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Posts: 8
Joined: March 20, 2017
Posted: March 20, 2017, 6:09 PM
Please guide me..
Trying to think of what helpful info I can give you all to get the best course of advice. My Ex-Husband is a 'functioning' alcoholic. I was a codependent enabler for 23 years of emotional abuse and bullying. Finally able to escape 1 year ago. Long history of family addiction on both sides. I've never been addicted to anything, always fearful of hard drugs because of the addiction in the family. 3 Children 20 B, 17 G, 15 B -- Girl lives with me and the 20 yr old. He has never lived on his own. Graduated last year at 19. Bay (20 yr old son) has some pretty big pipe dreams and has always been a dreamer - despite us being hardest on him. Ex- is Extremely authoritarian. I knew that my son had been smoking pot - I didn't freak out on him and so it continued, trying Acid & shrooms - I discovered - but he said everything else was off limits. Then he started using my house for his party pad. About 3 months ago, I told him enough and that he was heading down the wrong road - missing work (Great Job with great future 18 hr) I sent him to live with his dad. He flipped and went - started to get his life back together. Then conflict with his dad grew. One day He went into an absolute RAGE at his dad... I tried to calm him, but I had never seen him like that before. Later that night, he gets rushed to the ER. An odd incident that someone here can pin down; 2:00 a.m. ambulance trip to Hospital (30 mins away) while at friends. He said that he Started losing vision, Heart about to explode, couldn't walk, pale clammy, ... the Hospital did a drug test, but he's 20 so we have no clue of results. I found out from my daughter today that he confessed to using 'coke' 2 times. He moved back with me after the hospital issue. I have to end this now and I'm not sure how. If I kick him out he goes to stay with his druggie buddies. He was just tested clean on the 9th for his new job and started right up after. Help? | ||
Posts: 1764
Joined: June 27, 2016
Posted: March 20, 2017, 7:18 PM
bay - here is my long story, short. I hope it makes sense. your son sounds like the way my son started. a little in college. he worked every summer in a labor job - like landscaping. In the field he works in, they work at least 6 days a week. salaried, so no overtime pay.. eventually he was addicted to pain pills - in order to get up, work pain free, be motivated. but the addition made him broke and miserable. and he was selling. and driving a fast car. It took us about 6 months to confirm there was an addiction problem. the main problem was no money left at the end of the week. stating it went to gas and food. We told him he could not live at home. He quickly got job in another state and left within a month or so. promising he would fix this and change. For the next year it became a nightmare. We did not know the addiction was too strong for him to kick on his own. in two years, totaled 3 cars. no one else involved or injured. past two years lived in another state, rehab and sober living and jobs - but continued relapsing. we wanted to see him quit the addiction and really be clean, sober and happy on his own. About 4 months ago, he declared it was not going to work where he was. he wanted to come back home. we were not ready and thought he was not ready. his sister gave him a plane ticket to her house - she lives on the other side of the country. He has been clean for 4 months. but not working a program, he does not quite say what we want to hear... but he is tired of not working, and thru phone calls got a job back home with a previous employer. In the past two years, he has been homeless at times, not successful at trying to find a new career, has not had a car, has lost all of his belongings twice.
We would think he has learned a lesson, but we are not sure. we wont know til he gets back here and starts working again. we will try to be tough but patient. we do think that 4 months clean is not long enough to make a lasting commitment. It is really hard to separate from him when he is living with us. I came to this board to find out what works to keep a person from relapsing..... What I learned is that relapsing is common, and if they want to take drugs, they will, and there's nothing we can do about it. And when they want to quit, they will. my son is 27, his addiction started slowly and he hid it very well. He has told me that I can help him with finances (by showing him how to budget and pay bills) and possibly hold $$ for him for savings - which he has not followed thru on in the past... So, I hope he sticks to the plan. we are feeling that we have a 50/50 chance that he will either stay clean or go back to the friends group. Read the other postings and the ones titled : Ways Family Members can Help, What Not to do, Let me fall all by myself, Will you learn to say No Also find NarAnon meetings in your area, and if your son is open to it, NA meetings for him.... Definitely stop any enabling, if he cant do something himself, do not provide it for him. and try to get him to go to meetings. I know that rehab and sober living gave my son a program and knowledge and support and gave us a break where we could stop enabling and let go This post has been edited by NyToFlorida on March 20, 2017, 7:56 PM | ||
Posts: 733
Joined: October 5, 2015
Posted: March 20, 2017, 8:25 PM
Hi, Sorry your going through what the rest of us on here have and still are. Only difference I think is we're used to it ...if there is such a thing! I've had a daughter on drugs now 18 yrs. Started in on the heavy stuff just when she was 17 yrs old..maybe younger. Her drug of choice was heroin, but she advanced to crack, cocaine and probably others I don't know about. She is called an Omni drug user. Which means she likes more than one kind. According to a useless drug councilor we took her to years ago. Your son may have started slow but he's hit the big time now with cocaine. I've read on the cocaine board where some can do it for a while and just quit. Then there are others who pick up again after only trying it a few times and they get hooked on it that next try. Try reading many posts on there. It will help you understand what your up against. There is a board just about "Cocaine" on here too. I would imagine that would answer a lot of your questions. Hopefully someone who has been where your son is will come on and advise you what to do. I would tell you give him no money, nothing of value he can sell. Lock up all valuables, just incase. I guess him going to some meetings will help him too. If you find him doing drugs at home kick his butt out. That's not a good example to set for his sister. Hope you find help on here as I'm sure you will. Take care! Mary.
This post has been edited by Mandm on March 20, 2017, 8:36 PM | ||
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Posts: 8
Joined: March 20, 2017
Posted: March 20, 2017, 9:34 PM
Thank you so very much for replying. I come from a very dysfunctional background; parents addicts, siblings addicts. The only thing that saved me was God, taking both my parents at 10 and putting me in the foster system. My rough road - was not his. Which is why it is so crazy.
I have a decent relationship with my Ex - both of us agree that He can't go back to live with his dad. He is still unaware that we both know. I just found out today and I'm trying to determine how to approach him. Talk about driving fast cars. He bought a car V8 charger end of last month. The insurance was 478.00 and he had a check coming that would cover it from his old job. So, I put the car on my insurance under my name as driver for a week. Today, I told him I would have to take him off my insurance and he'd have to figure things out himself, when I learned he blew over 800 in a week and only had 82.00 to make it to his first new job check. Which is a good thing - I find out he was pulled over for speeding over 75 in a 55. Learning my daughter has been in the car as he flew over 110 down a country road. The good news is that he hasn't started stealing from us...at least that we can tell. He is stuck in a small town where Meth is Huge. With no money, he can't afford Coke. I need to determine How to tell him I know, Inform him he has a choice to make, Inform him What My rules are if his choice is if he lives here, How I am going to follow up to ensure he is staying clean. If he chooses to leave then he will go to live with his druggie buddies that he now has a job working with... and I'm going to have to love him and let him go. Please Please tell me your thoughts. Toni | ||
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Posts: 733
Joined: October 5, 2015
Posted: March 20, 2017, 10:05 PM
Hi Toni, I'd make your son park the car until he changes over the insurance into his name. You don't need to be sued if he gets in an accident because these lawyers will go after his grandmother too if they find out she has her own home...anything!! How do you know it's not Meth he's using? Especially if it's plentiful in your town? Usually if they like cocaine they will buy the cheaper stuff called "crack if they don't have much money. I wouldn't let my daughter spend time with him out of your sight. Last thing you need is him giving her a hit of whatever he's taking. Pretty soon the overseas girls will come on and advise you. They are recovering addicts themselves but are on a different time zone. About asking him if he's doing cocaine....I'm not one to mince my words, so I would be right out there and I'd be tough too. Let him know you won't put up with this kind of lifestyle he's slipping into. Tell him any signs or anymore nonsense like this and he's gone...out of the house. I'd tell him too that you could have went on his path but it's a choice you decided not to make because you wanted a good life with a family. Etc etc, I'm a bit much, but I'd let him have it. Especially now that I know he was driving crazy with his sister in the car. No more sister in his car anymore either. Hanging with friends that do drugs will make it hard not to do drugs too. Maybe he needs to find a different place to work and new friends that don't do drugs. Toni...take what you think will work from different posts and leave what you think won't. I'm sorry if I sound a bit harsh because its not my intent. I just think with you catching him at the start of his cocaine use then it might be a good idea to be tough with him. Also an after thought too....I would pull a sly pot test on your daughter when she doesn't suspect it. Seemingly they can start really young smoking pot. Wait until after a weekend or a sleepover at friends. No harm in watching her too! Don't tell her anything that you plan to do with your son either in case she lets him know. Good luck Toni, it's a difficult time being a mother in this day and age. I'll be thinking of you and wishing you well. Stay in touch! Mary.💛
This post has been edited by Mandm on March 20, 2017, 10:42 PM | ||
Posts: 2616
Joined: January 4, 2008
Posted: March 20, 2017, 11:16 PM
Confused here a bit....so...what besides the ambulance incident...how long ago was this btw ? ..and admitting to trying coke twice to his sister...has convinced you he's using regularly? ....symptoms sound like meth...but could have also been pcp.. .or any party drug out there ....I'm a heroin addict so not my doc and only taking a guess from what I've seen. ..I'm thinking proof would be best option. ..paraphernalia left around ? .We will always lie and deny our use...asking us directly is usually useless...would need more to go on before making the call ...
This post has been edited by constantine on March 20, 2017, 11:26 PM | ||
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Posts: 8
Joined: March 20, 2017
Posted: March 21, 2017, 6:19 AM
Again thank you...
He keeps a safe in his car/room that he has used in the past to keep his pot pipe, weed in. His sister has smoked with him and I knew about that. She has admitted to wanting to quit and hasn't smoked in a while. She is very close to me and I normally know everything. She knew the combo and we just opened it and found a bag of shrooms, about a fist full. Everything else was just weed related. I know I'm wrong for not dealing with this earlier and thinking that he could just smoke every now and then and control it. I personally stayed 'high' from age 7-10 - my sister introduced me/kept me high. Long and painful story - but I stopped when my parents died. The symptoms.. his father believes that he's been doing more than pot a long time. Ex-used in high school/college. I used to blow his paranoia off. My son has admitted to using LSD/acid on a regular basis/weekly. He has shown signs of all sorts in the recent past. Basically, I believe it has just started, coke. His best friend is now crushing pills and snorting them. His hospital trip was; extremely high heart rate, pressure. Said he had fluid around his heart, ekg normal, sweats. I think I am going to just have a 5-way urine test when he wakes up. Insisting he take it. Tell him, I know what he is doing, not asking; Telling him that if he is going to live here, there will be no more pot or any other drugs. Testing him weekly. He car is registered in his name and is financed. I had the car and him removed from my insurance. If he gets pulled over they will impound his car and he knows that. He won't be allowed to take my daughter or other son in his car. I'm sure when he wakes up it will be a horrible confrontation. I am going to keep my emotion out of it, remain calm and just say what I need to say. Thoughts? | ||
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Posts: 733
Joined: October 5, 2015
Posted: March 21, 2017, 7:32 AM
My thought is, he thinks he can do anything. Keeping a safe? What a nerve your son has. He really thinks he can do whatever he wants. It's going to be hard reeling him back in. He thinks he's the king of his domain! Time to dethrone him!! The snorting pills that his friend is doing are maybe opiates...bad!! That's the next step to heroin. Also with him keeping a safe?? Strange! It might be because he sells drugs too. I'd takeover the safe because that's ridiculous! What did you do with the mushrooms and the pot? Hopefully took them and flushed them. That's where his money is going is on drugs. Don't expect him or your daughter to tell you the truth. I wouldn't believe anything that comes out their mouth. She is in very dangerous waters too! Sounds like he influences her. Take care. Mary.
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Posts: 106
Joined: February 20, 2017
Posted: March 21, 2017, 8:08 AM
opiates...bad!! That's the next step to heroin. That was my sons drug of choice. It's a bad addiction as they all are but these come with demons that call your forever from what I hear and see with my son. I have listened to all the people hear as they have saved my sanity. I have cut my son off. Detached with love, learned to say no, and let him fall by himself. He is 26 is living with a friend older lady and been straight for the last few days. I am not celebrating just yet. I left him homeless, dirty and hungry and he didn't care. I always answered the phone just to know he was ok not to really talk to him. He has said mean and hateful things to me but I had to get strong. Still worried because he uses methadone and his program is taking him off and he don't want another program. He said he's tired of methadone controlling him. He says he feels bad but he's trying to stay strong. I'm praying for him. opiates...and heroin is so bad and scared he use again. He says he's gonna work with his docs and his meds the right way. Let's see God be with him. Today he has a job interview. I hope all goes well for him. My point I never thought I could detach with love , start saying no, and letting him fall all by himself would actually work. Thanks to the family I'll never meet here.
Dee I'll keep you and your family in my prays | ||
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Posts: 1764
Joined: June 27, 2016
Posted: March 21, 2017, 8:08 AM
one of my regrets - that I was not more strict sooner. we thought it was a 'once in a while' thing - we thought he was drinking and playing poker with friends. We figured he is an adult and would figure out he couldnt party and work 6-7 days a week.... but he kept doing it. Same with paychecks - it crept up slowly, but at the end - a 600 paycheck would be gone in a few days.
My son also bought a new car about 3-4 yrs ago before we knew about the drug use. betw car payment and insurance, it was about 600 per month. then when we kicked him out and he moved, he could not afford it. then he wrecked it. Do NOT allow anyone to drive with your son. tell your daughter not to get in car w him. Reading your family history - you know what you are dealing with. this might take a while, like it has with some of us. yeah, your on the right track, confronting it, setting boundaries. It is hard to face them and confront them. I sound good when giving advice here, but tend to melt when I am face to face with it. With our son coming back home, we will be facing these issues again... he's 27, treating him like he's 17. none of us want to feel that way, watching every move stinks and keeping a 'hands off' attitude does not work either. something in the middle - until he can soar on his own? Good Luck! Dee - Bless you! I am happy we have been able to help you. Even the little improvements are good. the more days he is away from drugs the better. it does take a long time. hold your ground, dont cave too soon! keep up the boundaries! This post has been edited by NyToFlorida on March 21, 2017, 9:43 AM | ||
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Posts: 8
Joined: March 20, 2017
Posted: March 21, 2017, 9:52 AM
Yes, I am very Pissed that he has brought this into our lives. It has always been, my Ex called it, All about Him - caring nothing for those around him. I figured it was the Teenage selfishness.
It is going to hurt. I'm going to confront him and give him an option to be on the right track, He won't choose it, I already know that. He will think I'm Out of My Mind if I Expect him to live by my conditions, He will be angry/rage, grab his stuff and leave. He will say horrible things and scream. I will try to remember that what he says/does - isn't personal - it is his pride and addiction. I feel guilty that I didn't throw a fit and slam my foot down when I knew he was smoking pot around here. I dismissed it as a phase. Then I knew it wasn't when he stopped taking showers. I guess we will know shortly when I wake him up. ((((Hugs))))) | ||
Posts: 60
Joined: March 13, 2017
Posted: March 21, 2017, 10:33 AM
Hi Bay. My son started using pot at 15. He quickly moved to hard drugs. Over the years we have put him in countless rehabs and then moved him from ny to Utah to live with wonderful family
For a new start I gave him my Subaru. He was there for 2 years while he was there he failed out of 2 of the 3 college semesters I paid for cuz of drugs Developed a heroin addiction. Got married and divorced and finally took the Subaru Outback I gave him and got a title loan on it to buy drugs. Obviously in the end the car was repossessed. Oh he picked up a at least 2 charges. So more lawyer payments for me. Before going to Utah he was living in Florida with his dad and he took his dads gf car another charge more lawyers it was dropped then he robbed his gF house to get her dads safe with drugs in it. now a big charge my 15k lawyer got him off. Back to ny after Utah lots of drugs and dealing and finally got caught selling 50 dollars worth of heroine to undercover cop so he could buy heroin to use. Now -another 15k in lawyers got charges dropped to a misdemeanor if he would get through drug court He failed out So judge sentenced hi to 2.5 in prison. He did almost 2 years got sober for a year now has now 2 years parole. He's violated parole 3 times now. He's in prison rehab for 45 days. There's more drug courts failed out of. I am a horrible enabler. I will not enable again. F him maybe when he's homeless and hungry he'll figure it out | ||
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Posts: 733
Joined: October 5, 2015
Posted: March 21, 2017, 10:36 AM
Hi Toni, It's awful the arguments and it's scary at times too. Don't let him see you have any doubt in your decision. It will give him ammo to lie more. Tell him that if he starts arguing with you that you'll call the police. No more Mrs Nice it's time to take the gloves off and let him know what happens when YOU get angry. Even if you have to fake it because I've done that too! He needs to know your the boss! If he doesn't like it let him leave! He will miss his creature comforts too much. I think your ex has been right about your son. But he hasn't helped any with his past behavior if your son has seen that. I'm really concerned about your daughter. Maybe it's because I have a daughter, I don't know! But with your son doing drugs like he has been I'm worried that she's following in his footsteps. When I was young my brother and I followed each other's footsteps..we were close and only a couple of year apart too. What he did I did. But never drugs. Do you have anyone to help you with this? Would your husband be with you when you confront him? Whatever you decide to do Toni good luck. Sounds like this has been going on too long. Whatever his friends do ...I think he'll have done too. I get the impression that he thinks he can do whatever he likes without any consequences and he thinks he knows it all. He believes he is immune to getting hooked on any drugs and is so in control of it all. I hope you get through to him. Take care. Mary.
This post has been edited by Mandm on March 21, 2017, 10:40 AM | ||
Posts: 529
Joined: October 15, 2016
Posted: March 21, 2017, 11:00 AM
obviously his health is affected by his drug use, not sure LSD and other hallucinogenic can cause heart problems but coke does and big time.. I am sorry, you need to set up boundaries what he can and cant do otherwise tell him he is out , its not only you who is affected but your other kids to and its only you who can change situacion as much as possibile. Will he keep promise and behave in house how you 2 agree i don't know, time will tell but you have to start from somewhere.
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Posts: 1764
Joined: June 27, 2016
Posted: March 21, 2017, 12:17 PM
Sad53 - I'm envious you said so much in such little space!
you have been around the block a few times too. we do have to get to the place where we are saying F them, inorder to make ourselves stronger to set boundaries. | ||
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Posts: 60
Joined: March 13, 2017
Posted: March 21, 2017, 8:32 PM
Hi Ny Yup
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Posts: 8
Joined: March 20, 2017
Posted: March 22, 2017, 3:33 AM
To Everyone... THANK YOU! I can't agree more about him. The Throne he believes he sits on is invincible in his eyes. So...
Tonight when he came home, he knew something was 'up' (how he put it). I was very calm, loving in my concern, but firm. I asked him about everything and he only told me what he 'thought' I may know, as he suspected his sister had told me. THEN, I said I wanted him to take a drug test. He didn't realize I already had it in the house. I watched him take it. It was a 6 way test. THC, Extasy, Meth, Coke, Opiods.. THC came back positive and the others negative-but some 'neg' results were DARK colored lines and others were faint negative. I filled a vial to send off to the lab for confirmed results... He couldn't believe I would do that part. Then I asked him about the shrooms and explained how the law classifies it and the punishment. He claimed they only treat it like pot - but it is in the class with heroin. I asked him if he had any in his safe, said 'maybe a little' - then I told him I had already opened the safe from his car last night and knew how much was in there. I watched him go get his safe and open it in front of me. There was only about 1/2 of what was there last night. I asked about the Coke and the lies went from long time ago, to used it Once in the past month. BUT I knew that to be a lie too. He was upset that I flushed his 3 g. of pot - and refused to flush his shrooms. I let him know that he had a choice to make about living under my roof. I started going through the conditions and he agreed with everything but smoking pot away. I suspect only because there are no tests for shrooms/LSD to my knowledge. Of course I didn't agree. He got angry when I asked him about his Best Friend snorting pain pills. Said he had to leave to calm down.... and wouldn't be back tonight. I explained he had a choice to make regarding the path ahead of him. His father and I have been talking about this and he thinks I was too soft - I was I'm sure, but the discussion is NOT over. He didn't realize his father knows until his dad sent him a text demanding he/we come to the house tomorrow evening to finish the discussion about tonight. Bay is scared of his father but has been getting bolder in past year talking about Him/Dad coming to 'Blows'. It may come to that. Ex needs to help put him in his place. Conditions will be: No Substance of Any Kind here or IN his system. Drug test at random. No one rides in his car or is alone with him until we can trust him and he gets insurance. Pays rent/cell phone and gets his insurance on his own. No money to him of any kind. He won't agree to the conditions. I know that, but it is a Choice HE has to make on his own. Live by my rules or he is Not welcome here. F'ing up his future is not something I'm willing to tolerate. I did apologize for not coming down on him when I found out he was smoking pot and that I was Wrong. I was loving and firm, but too soft. He is a grown man and does have an anger problem at times. I live next door to a police officer and I wouldn't have hesitated to pepper spray him and go next door. Me making him do anything is just a waste of time. I thought about flushing his mshrooms, but then he would be focused on how Evil I was and feel justified at being 'angry'. He needs to be focused on what I said and what his dad is about to deal with him on. Today: I was arguing and dealing with his father on the final details of our divorce agreement (23 yrs) and he was irrate over my insisting I get what I'm asking for financially. He Has his Own THRONE and feels that I don't deserve anything since he supported me for most of our marriage. Dilusional to say the least. BUT our son is something we Can agree on. My daughter suggested that I test her too and she was clean on everything, even the THC/Pot result and has been very honest. She is under the same conditions and has been focused on how wrong she was for smoking with him. She was introduced to Pot by him. She is heartbroken and angry with him and it is genuine. In the end - he hugged me, told us that he Loved both of us and left. He still doesn't Get IT. Tomorrow will be difficult. I Need you guys and am So grateful for you sharing your stories and advice. Thank you for helping me through these things. Who has else has had a child/loved one - jump straight from Pot - to LSD/shrooms and coke? Toni (((( HUGS)))) | ||
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Posts: 60
Joined: March 13, 2017
Posted: March 22, 2017, 8:03 AM
Hi Toni. If I could go back in time to the beginning, like you are at the beginning I would throw my 18 year old son in the street or I would run away and never look back.
If you find shrooms in your house or any drug throw it out. I promise you your son is lying when his mouth is moving. I'm so sorry you have to go through this. I guess as long as he's not taking opiates he'll be ok. | ||
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Posts: 733
Joined: October 5, 2015
Posted: March 22, 2017, 8:07 AM
Hi Toni, Good job! With him smoking pot for so long he might not be able to quit it right away as they have withdrawals coming off that too. My daughter use to go to some guys house who was a bit older than her and he grew those mushrooms and sold them. I don't know what else he sold though. I got a call by the police one night, she was like 16-17 and the police wanted me to come get her. The house had a swat team hit it while she was in there, unbelievable right? But they had all the younger ones parents come get them. Many years later the guy who sold the mushrooms was arrested for murder. He stabbed his pregnant girlfriend to death. He's in prison for life. I think whatever drugs he was on must have gave him a bad hallucination and that's why he did it. My daughter gets paranoid and anxious when she does pot. Don't know why that would be as it's meant to do the opposite. But she says she is going to smoke it to get off methadone. She's been on methadone for 8 yrs but still did drugs. Your doing real good and I know it's hard but now you've got it going stay strong, because he'll be looking for a crack in your armor and if he finds one he'll run with it. Take care, Mary💛
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Posts: 2616
Joined: January 4, 2008
Posted: March 22, 2017, 5:11 PM
Boundaries are for you...and to let us know what to expect...may I gently suggest you examine your motives to ensure they are about you...not about trying to control our addiction... trying to fix us..or trying to manipulate us into stopping. ..we are master manipulators...and can sense coercion like a 6th sense....this must be about your protection ..not about you trying to cure...change...or control your addict....because if it is...I guarantee you. ..it will not work...
This post has been edited by constantine on March 22, 2017, 5:29 PM | ||
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