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Posts: 1764
Joined: June 27, 2016
Posted: January 8, 2017, 9:44 AM
go to a therapist. you need someone to talk it out. or psychiatrist who can give you meds to take the edge off while being clean.
Also - I read that cravings are worst when hungry or dehydrated or tired. Start making a daily plan to follow that includes food, water, sleep and exercise. there's a recent post on another tab regard ing supplements that help. | ||
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Posted: January 15, 2017, 10:23 PM
I have been seeing a therapist.
But my cravings do not coincide with my appointments. I cannot imagine any reputable doctor prescribing something to "take the edge off." Especially to an addict! My therapist has suggested that I do more 12-step recovery, but I think I need more direct one-on-one help. I have done the SMART worksheets, I am careful about food and sleep, but cravings do come on from time to time. Before getting into any formal program, I got a lot of help from friends. I would call them when I wanted to use and most of the time, just talking made the cravings manageable. It is just hard now to go back to them, since they all think I beat this years ago--and live halfway across the country. I feel like if I could have someone to talk to like this, and could get some time under my belt, I could probably go to 12-step recovery and get something out of it. Now, 12-step meetings just make me feel alone and afraid, which intensifies the cravings rather than alleviating. Working on the steps involves writing about my drug use, which also is more than I can handle right now. I am afraid of working on the steps and my sponsor thinks I am just looking for an excuse to use. So he wants me to write even more. I know ultimately we have to face this alone. But I do not think I can yet. | ||
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Posts: 1764
Joined: June 27, 2016
Posted: January 17, 2017, 8:40 PM
I understand what you are saying, how long have you been clean. the cravings will become less and less. keep reading here and keep trying other things, and the same things. what did not help last month, may help next month. keep going back to the basics of food, water, sleep. and distraction.
regarding other meds. It is true that temporarily taking a non narcotic, non addictive medicine can help during the period of withdrawals and having cravings. I have read about a few of them here. Overfifty takes other meds. And there is a lot regarding supplements. read thru the posts, make a list, research whether the successfulness of the supplements. also be aware of planning ahead to combat cravings. set yourself up to succeed before you get to cravings. if you dont want to pursue other meds, look for acupuncture, naturopath, homeopath. This post has been edited by NyToFlorida on January 17, 2017, 8:42 PM | ||
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Posted: January 18, 2017, 1:04 AM
My cravings come two to four times a year.
I cannot predict when they come.I can usually stave them off for a week or two. But they do become more intense. Even so I can sometimes keep it off for a month or so. But eventually, it just becomes easier to give in. So I have my binge day and then I do not have to think about drugs for another few months. I guess I have to learn how to do this on my own, but even when you suggest these techniques I wish I could talk face to face with someone about them, rather than reading about them in a book or on line and figuring it out for myself. | ||
Posts: 433
Joined: December 14, 2009
Posted: January 26, 2017, 5:15 PM
You most certainly do not have to do this on your own. That is what the 12 steps are all about. Meetings are not the answer, working with other addicts is. Hence you will not be alone.
Unfortunately the easiest and most common place to meet like minded people is at the meetings. So change your approach, it's not what you get out of the meetings, but what you bring to them. Reach out to others that still suffer and help them along the way. Be well, Larry -------------------- All gods send their drunks to AA My story.. https://www.addictionrecoveryguide.o...ST&f=16&t=63644 
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Posted: January 27, 2017, 1:21 AM
I have no idea about what I could do to "work with addicts" from meetings---especially since my ideas of what is helpful is at odds with the 12-step program.
Also, I am not sure that I can do much without getting triggered. I often leave meetings because I find the talk triggering. It does not even have to be about drug use. Just being in a room with a bunch of addicts is enough to make me think of using. If my own addiction is not under control, how can I help anyone else? Can I say to someone, "I have to go now because being around you makes me think about smoking crack."??? And when someone has cravings, I do not think I could hang up on them. I disagree with AA and NA so much on this. But because of my own weakness, I understand why it recommends not trying to help those who get to the point of craving. | ||
Posts: 243
Joined: August 18, 2016
Posted: January 28, 2017, 12:12 AM
If you are risking your sponsor's program by talking about your struggles with cravings, then your sponsor has probably not been in recovery long enough and/or doesn't have a solid foothold in recovery to help you. There is a time, after being in recovery for a time, when cravings tend to abate. That's not to say you won't get one from time to time, but they do become less frequent the longer you are away. If you have a sponsor with many "clean" years who can't talk to you about something as basic to drug abuse and recovery as cravings, I would question how qualified they are to help you. A sponsor is supposed to help you APPLY the steps to your life and your life includes cravings..so if they aren't willing to help you with that, I do not feel they are doing their job as a sponsor.
It seems like perhaps the 12 step program isn't enough for you right now. SMART recovery is one I have found very helpful. I know you said you didn't feel it worked, but maybe it would be worth another go. I mean, people go to many, many 12 step meetings before they find one that they jive with, so maybe try a few different smart meetings...they are all different. Have you tried individual therapy? You said you felt you needed someone to talk to, so maybe a good therapist would help. You could hire a "recovery coach". They are people who shadow you and help you with living your new sober life. They are available 24 hours a day if you need them. (Pretty pricey from what I hear, though!) I would also consult with an addiction specialit. While there are currently no FDA approved drugs for coke cravings, there are medications they use off lable that help with them. Perhaps that might help you get through this difficult time. | ||
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Posted: January 28, 2017, 12:41 AM
I have had a few sponsors and not talking about cravings was always one of the ground rules, so I think it is standard. And in meetings one frequently hears that there is nothing that you can do to help someone who is having cravings. (Often quoted is a passage from How It Works that talks about how "probably no human power could have relieved our alcoholism.") I know SMARTrecovery is more willing to engage with cravings, but in my experience, 12 step based programs are not.
I might do better with SMARTrecovery if there were meetings near me. Being alone with the materials is not very effective for me. I think I may just have to bite the bullet with Recovery Coaches. | ||
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Posts: 243
Joined: August 18, 2016
Posted: January 28, 2017, 2:44 AM
I do not know where you live but I can say that I have NEVER had that experience in ANY 12 step meeting. You may have to travel a bit if this is a pervasive mentality in your area. That attitude is counter intuitive to the 12 step program in general and I think you have been getting some bad advice by some truly misinformed people!
That being said, I know you have some very set ideas about what works for you, and as individuals, we do know ourselves best. However, you seem very resistant to any and all suggestions. I get it! Recovery can be very frustrating when we do not ecperience the relief we are looking for. I would suggest that if you try Smart again (by the way, they offer WAAAAAY more than worksheets! They have a very active website I suggest you check out) or recovery coaching or whatever...give it a fair shake. Trying things for a week or two isn't enough. It takes dedication to reverse old habits. Do you have any psychiatric issues such as depression? Deoression can exaserbate cravings and make us feel overwhelming despair and fatigue that makes putting in the work of recovery almost impossible. Perhaps a visit to a psychiatrist to rule out any underlying anxiety or depression mught be in order. We all use for a reason. The sooner you identify why you use, the sooner you can work out a plan to address those issues. How long have you been actively attending meetings? Have you ever been evaluated for dual diagnosis? It may feel helpless now, but there is something out there to help you. You just might have to start at the beginning again. Sometimes starting from scratch gives us a better foundation. NA has only ONE promise to make, and that is: "The message is that an addict, any addict, can stop using drugs, lose the desire to use, and find a new way to live.... That is all we have to give." (NA Basic Text, 5th Ed., p. 65) This is a quote from the NA text and clearly points out that cravings (the desire to use) is not an "off limit" topic. There is an NA chatroom online. I just poked around there and there are many, many, many post dealing with cravings and with people offering 12 step support to help conquer them. Might be worth checking out, especially being you have experience with 12 steps and it is already familiar to you. Another quote from NA website Can Narcotics Anonymous Help Me Fight Cravings? Yes, Narcotics Anonymous can help you fight cravings. Cravings are a completely normal part of recovery. Even if you do your best to avoid trigger situations, cravings may still occur. Narcotics Anonymous owes much of its success to sponsorship. If you have the urge to use drugs, you can call or meet with your sponsor to discuss your cravings. Talking it out can remove the power from cravings, and they will pass. Your NA sponsor is there for you throughout the 12-step fellowship program and is a source of strength and support. Perhaps NA would be a better fit than AA for you. There own literature states that sponsors should be there to help with cravings, so like I said, I think you have been fed some misinformation. This post has been edited by lolleedee on January 28, 2017, 3:16 AM | ||
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Posted: January 28, 2017, 10:41 AM
Thank you so much.
I do not think I am resistant. I am very willing to try recovery coaches or anything else that is new to me. However, I have been in recovery for about 16 years, and I am resistant to trying the same things over and over in the hope of getting a different result. (AA says that is the definition of insanity.) I did use SMARTrecovery's website for about 2 years, but the dogmatism there was hard to deal with. So many people asking for help being made to feel ashamed and stupid. I got off easy, but only because I was cautious about what I posted and chatted with there. In recovery programs, there seems to be a tendency toward dogmatism, which I think comes from desperation and the addictive pathology. I do keep going back to 12-step recovery because my therapist says it is the most helpful. However, he is unsure if I fit the profile of an addict, because my use at this point only every few months and does not interfere with my life. I wonder if this lack of "profile" may be part of why these programs have not helped much. I have not seen that part of the website that you quote, and it does surprise me to see them say that. However, so much of what is said in the literature is at odds with the practice of the program, that I wonder if this is the same. I do not know if you yourself have been through 12-step recovery, but after a decade and a half in many fellowships, that is not how it is practiced in real life. The big emphasis is on finding a higher power, which is said to be the ONLY thing that can help you when cravings hit. The 12-steps and How It Works (which are read at almost every AA meeting) are very clear about that. That said, I may not be desperate enough for any program. Most of my life is fine. My drug use at this point does not have a significant negative impact in my life, but it is something I would be happier to eliminate completely. 12-step recovery is great for when you have nothing and need help with putting your life together. People were very generous in helping me get an apartment, a job, a car, etc. Many offered to drive me to church. But that is not really what I need right now. | ||
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Posts: 243
Joined: August 18, 2016
Posted: January 28, 2017, 8:48 PM
I think you would find what I am talking about at Narcotics Anonymous, not Alcoholics Anonymous. AA is geared toward alcoholics and I have found they tend to be more strict than NA. People in NA are familiar with drug craving and are there to help you.
I have been involved in 12 step recovery, but for me, it was not exactly what I needed or what worked for me. Everyone has to find their own path to recovery and recovery can take many forms. I have to ask, what do you consider "dogma" Can you give me a specific example of what you mean? I have found Smart to be the complete opposite and the one place I do not have to sensor what I say. You may need to get another therapist who you can mesh with better. If they are of the belief that 12 step is the only/best way and for you it is not, then I would consider moving on. Not all drug use is drug abuse. Addiction is a very specific disease that manifests itself in very predictable ways. If you use only a few times a year and it does not interfere with your life, job, relationships, finances etc then is it really a problem? Why do you view it as a problem? Have you ever had an addiciton to alcohol or other drugs? Sorry for all the questions, but I am just trying to get the whole picture! | ||
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Posted: January 29, 2017, 12:56 AM
Yes, my drug use is a problem because it takes up mental space and I cannot control myself when I use. It may be a binge, but I still would rather not be obligated to use. I want to be able to choose not to without having to fight with my body and brain. I also think having a hidden part of my life is not good to me. And I think that having sexuality centered on narcotics is not a good thing.
In my experience, NA and AA (as well as all the other A's) are pretty similar--it is generally the same people at both, they take place in the same locations, and the meetings are pretty much the same. It does not seem to be that much of a difference. CA and CMA are closest to my experience, but they tend to trigger me more than AA and NA> Dogma is telling people that the reason they are having whatever problem is that they are not following SMARTrecovery closely enough. Or if they do not understand SMARTrecovery it is because they are not reading closely enough. Or if SMARTrecovery is not helping them, it is because they are doing it wrong. And again, it really has been personal connection that has helped me in the past. 12-step recovery people are always there to weigh in on my career, where I live, how I eat, my car, etc. but I do not see much use in a program that will put every aspect of your life under the magnifying glass, but will not help me when I most need it. I am just tired of all this. Maybe I need to start my own recovery organization rather than trying to fit into ones that are not helpful for me. | ||
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Posts: 1764
Joined: June 27, 2016
Posted: January 30, 2017, 6:00 PM
16 years is a long time clean. maybe it is some thing genetic that triggers you, or cycles thru the cravings. AhHa! I read that the drug stays for sometime in the tissues and cells in the body. as the cells die, they dump the old drug in to the blood stream. this is what causes the craving.
Since you are using every 4 to 6 months, you reset the clock each time. you store some more doc in your cells. whenever you have your next craving, ignore it and push it out longer. maybe if you are very focused on getting past the craving with out using, it will then stop the craving for longer. you may want to try a naturopath. the cost is expensive at first but followups are reasonable, and not often. be aware of buy only a few supplements at a time, dont let them talk you into a lot of stuff. homeopath consults on what homeopathic medicine to take. Homeopathic medicine is tailored to your needs depending on your symptoms | ||
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Posts: 433
Joined: December 14, 2009
Posted: January 31, 2017, 6:31 PM
Okay. I seem to be hearing a lot of my story and attitude, First did you read my thread? Can you relate to it? What sticks out most?
I still sense some resistance in doing what needs to be done. I once heard some one say "you will have to do some things you won't like and you won't be able to do somethings you enjoy" This defines a responsible, disciplined and courageous lifestyle. are you ready to commit? Be well, Larry -------------------- All gods send their drunks to AA My story.. https://www.addictionrecoveryguide.o...ST&f=16&t=63644
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Posted: February 1, 2017, 8:39 AM
larrylive--
I think what sticks out most is how obviously helpful it was for you to document your recovery. Putting it all out there seems to really help you, and using a forum allowed you to be more honest about your relapse than you could in any recovery group. I assume that in other threads you document more the process of your recovery. "Doing what needs to be done" is something I disagree with. I do not want to leave my career and home. I am told in 12-step recovery that I need a humbler job and should not be in a position with any authority until I have five clean years under my belt. I am told I should show willingness by moving to another neighborhood. And my car is not good enough. What all this has to do with recovery is beyond me. I have been at this a long time and have tried to work out what needs to be done. Mostly I have tried SMARTrecovery where they are pretty strict about following their directions to the letter and 12-step recovery where they give you directions on everything but staying clean. That you are supposed to figure out on your own. Even those first few steps are so vague that no one can agree on whether you have done them or not. There has to be a happy medium. I think recovery is a bigger process than just going through a checklist and also I do not think that my recovery will be benefited by spending more while earning less. I think a naturopath is worth trying. | ||
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Posts: 1764
Joined: June 27, 2016
Posted: February 3, 2017, 11:26 AM
Another suggestion. when you begin having the cravings fill up on food - protein and potatoe, veg and water. not sweets - sweets might make the cravings worse. maybe turkey - and gravey - to make you tired and not want to go out and score.
if you are afraid of gaining weight, fast a bit when you are not having cravings. Also incorporate Vitamin C and B complex - that a little more than what is recommended on the bottle. Vitamins will help with the ups and downs of energy. fill in the gaps where nutrition isnt enough and the body needs more of something. Then, get on a treadmill until you cant walk no more.... lol look into buying a used treadmill, if you can put it in your living room where you can use it while still being a part of the tv watching or what ever is going on. make it convenient. let us know what works. :) | ||
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Posted: February 4, 2017, 11:39 AM
What you talk about sounds good for one night, but typically the cravings last longer. I can usually stave them off for a week with good diet and distractions, but by the end of the second week is when it gets overwhelming.
I am realizing that maybe no advice really works and that we all have to find our own way. I have tried to fill my schedule with activities like 12-step recovery recommends...but then I have a day free. Or if I could fit a treadmill in my home, there are going to be days when I am not home. All of this is probably helpful for the first week of cravings, but by the second and third week, I just do not think I have the self-discipline to keep up the routine. Or if I have the self-discipline, I might not have the time. There is going to be a day where I won't be able to eat or exercise and I have a day off. Your suggestions are good and you are kind. But they are pretty close to what I have been doing (making sure I eat enough and stay physically active). But when I am in a craving period, I cannot bank the recovery. I get one bad day or two---and there I am again. So I guess my question is, what do you do when you cannot get to your treadmill? Or you do not have time to eat properly? Or when you just are tired? How do you deal with the escalation during the craving period? And how many weeks does it take for the cravings to subside? Most of the time, I do not really want to use but rather just want to get the using over so I can get back to normal life. | ||
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Posted: February 4, 2017, 4:25 PM
And I am sorry to go on so panicked sounding. This is the one part of my life where I feel like a child. There is so much fear and shame and uncertainty around my addiction.
And maybe I am not willing enough. I have to admit that the idea of giving up my job and career is hard for me to accept. So maybe that means that I have too much ego to ever truly recover. | ||
Posts: 529
Joined: October 15, 2016
Posted: February 4, 2017, 9:09 PM
so far you refused every suggestion we made I dont think you are unwilling i think you will try everything in your power if it sounds right to you but so far nothing did right? It must be some professional person out there that you can talk to when s*** hits the fun ? It seems to me that that idea of having this person on 1 to 1 basis is what you like most, am I right? I wouldn't give up my job or move my home either and nothing wrong with that .. its your right not to! and why would you, what good that will bring.. it wont change anything dont you think?
Peace Bonnie :) ps: what about us here on this board, we are pretty good listeners many of us.. could we help with your "problem"? | ||
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Posted: February 5, 2017, 8:41 PM
I do not think I rejected anything here other than going on medication to take the edge off.
Some of the suggestions have been things I tried--and some are things I do now. But I do not see any sense to going back to doing things that did not work in all the past. It is nice that you agree that there is not point to moving, quitting my career, buying a different car, etc. But in 12-step recovery, a great deal of stock are put in those things. Three separate sponsors dumped me for not taking those suggestions. And I think that my unwillingness to take such actions has kept people in the program distant from me. To be honest, I do not know what to do when the crisis comes. Yes, I can post here, and people will listen. But what do I do while waiting for a response. The cravings only come every few months, but what no one has ever been able to make suggestions about what to do in the midst of them. Suggestions are made to prevent them. And I have a number of strategies for that. But over the weeks a craving lasts, there does come a time when they get very strong. It may be that there is nothing to do but try to tough it out. And what works changes. I have tried going to meetings and sometimes they help me fight off the craving and other times they make it worst. Sometimes eating helps, but sometimes it just makes me nauseous to eat in the middle of a craving. But I guess there is no one thing that any addict can count on in those situations. | ||
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