Why Don't They Want It?
Posted: March 27, 2019, 10:31 PM


Posts: 382
Joined: November 9, 2018



Yes it's scary how irrational they are. I just think at some level, they can put 2 and 2 together to see their life is going in the tank because of drugs/alcohol. I'm sure it's overwhelming, hard, and they like their addiction but the price of poker is HIGH. Its a subculture existence yet they choose to live it. I know some say they have to hit rock bottom. My daughter has hit so many rock bottoms I would think even just one would be enough to scare her into sobriety. Sadly, the bottoms get lower and lower.
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Posted: March 30, 2019, 1:44 PM


Posts: 382
Joined: November 9, 2018



Just read a good quote.... "Sobriety isn't something you want, or even something you need, it's something you do."
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Posted: March 30, 2019, 7:13 PM


Posts: 1499
Joined: June 27, 2016



you are so right. I read something recently: People don't choose to be addicts (to have the predisposition or illness or whatever we want to call it) They do choose to relapse.

I thought that was a powerful statement.

On the home front: I see my son's pattern. He needs us for car, gas, float him from week to week. The job is just money to serve his habit. the car is just a vehicle to get what he needs. He does not take care of the car. on his own he quickly looses the car, the job, the pay check, the housing.
his phone is off our account. wont pay it, that will be done. we just found out he wrecked the car. cant get to work.(he did not tell us - tow shop called us) no pay after this week. we are waiting for the flag of surrender. Our only answer - go to hospital rehab - go to sober living - we are out of the 'car' business.

conclusion: he needs to live where he can go to work without a car. if someone can not maintain a car, they cant have one.

On your point: so hard for us to understand. example: I need a car to go to work. I will do everything to keep the car running..... that is not my son's priority....

it is a pitty, what these drugs do to our loved ones.


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Posted: March 31, 2019, 12:31 PM


Posts: 382
Joined: November 9, 2018



NTF you are wise to give up on giving him a car. I hope he will choose to go to the hospital or sober living. I think he knows now he can't manipulate you anymore which is a good thing. Stay focused on your well being and your new job.
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Posted: March 31, 2019, 1:32 PM


Posts: 1499
Joined: June 27, 2016



thanks for your support. all of the steps we are going thru are things I know, things I have read. we were not able to enforce before this. I know when son is not sober he can not maintain a car and has accidents. before this we were not able to pull the car out from under him. we gave him the chance to succeed. which he has not. the car is going to junk yard. he will be off our insurance forever. he made it easy for us. he wrecked the car. at least we wont feel guilt for 'making him loose his job bc he has no car'. we wont be pysc'd into thinking that 'if he had a car, all would be well'. we have succeeded in getting him out of the house, off the phone plan, off our insurance. we will not go back. we now know it wont work. I guess we had to go thru it all to detach on our own terms. I can think back and say I wish we did this years ago, but we all had to go thru the learning process. we can now be determined not to get sucked in again in the future. husband and I need to lick our wounds and recoop our losses, and will call police if he shows up. hopefully he does not. .

I think active addiction makes him too dumb to see actions = consequences, or not care about possible consequences. the drugs put the brain to sleep like anesthia. he's awake, but half asleep for the past 6 months.

I can live with my (our) decisions bc I know my son knows what to do.

It is sad that we allow them to inflict pain on us, but we are hesitant to inflict pain on them.

shortly before my son left home there was a conversation where my husband told him - I will give you this and this and if you (*fail me*) - there will be war. Son agreed and understood what he meant. (*I don't remember the exact words)

** definitely a subculture existence


This post has been edited by NyToFlorida on March 31, 2019, 1:40 PM
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Posted: March 31, 2019, 3:48 PM


Posts: 145
Joined: December 21, 2018



Sallyanna -sobriety is something you do

Exactly. Talk is cheap. Physically sober is an accomplishment.
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Posted: April 6, 2019, 8:55 AM


Posts: 30
Joined: March 11, 2018



Why don't they want it? A profound question posed by Sallyanna. Amazingly, the addiction seems to feed itself, little by little starving out the addict. To me it seems to be rooted in obsessive-compulsive behavior/disorder. My daughter's addiction would seemingly haunt her, at times awaken her from a dead sleep with cravings. None of us non-addicts can understand this. Can you imagine having a true "one track mind" that you can't shut off? I think the addict would love to shut off their minds, and I think they accomplish just that when they use. So their addiction is much more about relief of the haunting thoughts, sating the crying baby so to speak, than it is about the excitement of the lifestyle and the feeling of the high. But every time they relent to the crying baby, the emboldened screams of the addiction grow louder. It's a never ending cycle, and they are trapped. It's very sad, and I always felt compassion for my daughter for the torment she was experiencing. What a dreadful disease. It's why such a small percentage of addicts ever free themselves. We, as loved ones, can never give up on the addict. While they're still breathing, we have to believe they can be one of the few to escape.
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Posted: April 6, 2019, 1:18 PM


Posts: 382
Joined: November 9, 2018



Jointheclub your post makes so much sense to me. It describes my daughter's addiction so well. Right now she's in full blown active addiction and her communication with me has been erratic which scares me. Today we had a planned phone call to talk at a specific time. No answer. Last she said was she was wanting to go back for help so we were going to go over the details together. This is so tough. I'll never give up on her and always be available. Its just hard to know what to do in the meantime and when she's really out of it. I know she's suffering and using to cope. I hope she will get the help she needs soon. Thank you very much for your post.
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Posted: April 6, 2019, 5:38 PM


Posts: 168
Joined: December 23, 2018



my son can't keep his stories, I mean lies straight. He lies about EVERYTHING!! EVERYTHING!!! His ex reached out & I am absolutely amazed at what he has told her about us, his brothers, his own life. He is so narcissistic - he believes he is a super hero, he's seen & done everything & has done it better than anyone, ever. Told her he has owned several of his own businesses (no), was a contractor & home inspector (again, no). Of course he left out that he started doing meth in high school, hide it from family & friends for years. Bought & lost 2 different homes, has been arrested numerous times for stupid drug/alcohol assaults/fights/childish stuff & a couple of times for dangerous, Dom Violence stuff. Has ruined 3 serious relationships, had had restraining orders against him, divorced once. Wrecked IDK how many vehicles - owes fines, has outstanding tickets, owes taxes, back taxes.... The ONLY good thing that has come from his crazy life is he never had a child.
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Posted: April 6, 2019, 8:44 PM


Posts: 1499
Joined: June 27, 2016



join the club: the same here for my son. he says he cant sleep bc of racing thoughts, persistant thoughts, going over all the bad things that have happened in the past 10 years. when he was sober in summer 2018, he did get medication - quitepine (Seroquel). It helped greatly in being able for the thoughts to calm down so he could sleep. when he was in rehab for a week (they say) he did not sleep for 6 days, then they gave him a medication (odd that they let it go so long) he has always had trouble with insomnia and that is the worst part of his withdrawals. along with the thoughts.

sad thing is that if he stayed sober long enough, bad things would not happen and if he actually sincerely apologized to people and kept his promises, he would not have so much bad things to think about. when he was in treatment once he wrote letters to his family, but did not give them to us!

my son had the best 3 months of sobriety. I have hope he can do it again and if he adds some good behavioral therapy, he may be successful. he has to want to change his life.

yes to your description of feeding the addiction.


This post has been edited by NyToFlorida on April 6, 2019, 8:45 PM
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Posted: April 6, 2019, 8:59 PM


Posts: 1499
Joined: June 27, 2016



mtnmom - it is so relentless. I told my husband your recent experience paying your son's truck payment. he says Thank You for sharing so he remembers NOT to go that route. my son wrecked his/our car - says a truck ran him off road - hit pole - at lunch break. at noon he cant even stay on the road. the road he was on is windy and narrow, but people don't hit poles every day. he was probably driving too fast and looking at phone. the pole does not snap if you are driving slow. he does not understand that he needed to keep the car drivable to get to work. I don't understand how that is not a priority. drive slow, stay off phone ( sorry for my rant)

I guess I do understand that he only has one priority and his brain is thinking at a very low level of comprehension.

husband will give him a ride to work next week (he offered, don't know if son will do it) I don't expect it to last long. son now lives 30 mins in opposite direction of job. I am staying out of it. son is talking like he wants to fix the truck he wrecked in September. big ideas, no resources. husband needed reminder to not get sucked in.

son had several fender benders w the car only in march and something hit our ins company - he rear ended someone. in February, grill was banged up.

*** Its never his fault ***

weird - husband and I have not hit a pole ever, or rear ended anyone in 40 years of driving. my last accident was more than 30 years ago when someone rear ended me!

I think the difficult part for us is that we think they learn a lesson (like we would) and we know transportation is key to keeping a job, and we want him to keep a job....

we are wrong - we cant want these things more than he does. at some level we think getting him to work will help him succeed. we don't want to be the reason for his failure (to work)…

collectively, it is hard to say no even when we know we are wrong to help them.

we are trying to get our son to move to a sober living where he can work and live in a community where he does not have to drive.

it is dangerous to the sober people on the road to let our son drive again.

This post has been edited by NyToFlorida on April 6, 2019, 9:05 PM
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Posted: April 6, 2019, 9:06 PM


Posts: 382
Joined: November 9, 2018



I texted my daughter later this afternoon to ask if she was ok? (she did not answer her phone earlier for our planned phone time). Her response was 'yea'. This is so hard to know what to do. I really hate this feeling. Its become a tangled ball of yarn and I just want to unravel it. Does anyone else feel this way?
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Posted: April 6, 2019, 9:09 PM


Posts: 1499
Joined: June 27, 2016



sallyanna - so sorry you are going thru it again. be at peace knowing you have done as much as you can. this is the first time in 6 years that I have taken a break from my son. so far my husband is OK with it. he told son I moved out of the area bc I could not deal with either one of them anymore. son just shook his head. he has not contacted me. I have had a peaceful and exhausting week one of my new job.

PS - I try not to think that my son could stay in the subculture for many years, avoiding sobriety.
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Posted: April 6, 2019, 9:11 PM


Posts: 168
Joined: December 23, 2018



I'm SO SAD, so anxious, nervous, etc.
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Posted: April 6, 2019, 9:12 PM


Posts: 1499
Joined: June 27, 2016



sallyanna - I do remember those times a year ago. when my son was in heavy addiction and we kicked him out. I would worry if I did not hear from him. If I got a response like 'yea', then I was able to sleep that night. wait for the next day.

mtnmom - I would be upset too, after the phone calls you and your husband received. at this time I am relieved my son does not have a car. what ever he does is not our fault.

we were hoping he would have taken our offer to give him a plane ticket to the sober living he had been at a few yrs ago. he would only have to work and pay rent and follow the rules. public transportation was available.

This post has been edited by NyToFlorida on April 6, 2019, 9:16 PM
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Posted: April 6, 2019, 9:14 PM


Posts: 382
Joined: November 9, 2018



I'm so happy you are feeling better. Do you like your new job? I'm going to put my mind on me for the rest of the weekend and do somethings I enjoy. Today I really worried all day...
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Posted: April 6, 2019, 9:19 PM


Posts: 382
Joined: November 9, 2018



So sorry mtnmom I understand your sadness and anxiety. I think like NTF said we have done the best we can and at some point they have to pick up the rope. Its there they have to pick it up. Sadly, they trip on it and it gets tied in knots then whatever else can happen to a rope!?!
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Posted: April 6, 2019, 9:20 PM


Posts: 1499
Joined: June 27, 2016



thank you. I like the new job. computer IT stuff. there is so much new applications and information to learn. I am happy to be learning. and grateful the manager saw that I am capable of learning. I am getting a bit older and never reached a high point in my career bc I worked part time when the kids were young, so I got a late start. I have been 'terminated' a few times in recent years - I am getting used to it and feel confident I will find a new job. the last one and this one were found using an employment agency. I don't need benefits, so I don't care if I stop and start jobs, just as long as the paychecks are coming in.!

the weekend is toooo short!

This post has been edited by NyToFlorida on April 6, 2019, 9:24 PM
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Posted: April 6, 2019, 9:35 PM


Posts: 1499
Joined: June 27, 2016



I'm not sure what clicked for me. to make me leave my home and family and feel at peace with it. 2018 was a year of large car expenses - son wrecked husband's truck. Husband loved the truck so we had it fixed. very expensive. I needed a newer car - mine went to junk yard. my husband pick up a truck for son for a grand and put some work into it. paying registrations, insurances... repairs … Oh - just remembered - we got ripped off buying a car for 2300, put a radiator in it for 500 then realized it was a bad head gasget - I got stuck with it over heating and towed it straight to junk yard after having it only a few weeks - with over heating problems every day. called the seller who ignored me. he sold us a shi**y car and basically took our $$ and we got nothing.
we bought a temp car for me for 1000, which my son was now driving and just wrecked after wrecking his truck in September. we did find a good car for me that I am happily driving.

I let son drive it in January for a few days - he broke the change compartment. (When they are impaired everything gets broken and lost.) I was firm on not letting him drive it after that.

when son went to rehab and was sober. I saw how well he was doing (unfortunately he said he was still miserable and it was not well or fun or easy)

then in the fall to winter he relapse and I was 'helping' him by stocking fridge with all his favorites - food for lunches - making dinner almost every night - gas - cigs as needed, paying student loan and minimum on a credit card.... all of this and NO THANKS from him.... no effort to start paying something. nearly half my check was going to his stuff - he was making same as me. he got to keep his whole check and take half of mine! I was not able to save anything and my share of paying household bills was getting squeezed....

when I asked him for $$ from paycheck - for myself and for his bills - it quickly became a Hot Mess. WTF !!

with the help of everyone here I finally saw how ridiculous and unfair this was.

Still he has not made amends. not even a sorry.

I am not angry - I let it be done to me - I simply vow to not let it happen again.


*** LOL - I think A LOT Clicked for me ***

This post has been edited by NyToFlorida on April 6, 2019, 9:49 PM
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Posted: April 6, 2019, 10:04 PM


Posts: 168
Joined: December 23, 2018



It clicked for us probably last week & clicked & locked behind me after the calls & attacks. I am so thankful I live 1000 miles away from him, but also my other sons. My sons understand that this is not their brother doing this, this is a meth monster that has possessed his life. He is a bull in a china closet, one horrific decision after another. I do hope that he has no choice but to detox & find a long term sober living house. But I've decided now that even if he gets sober & tries to contact us, I will tell him not without a counselor or therapist.

I do find so much support from you all here. Thank you for being there.
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