Jail Visits
Posted: July 15, 2019, 9:32 PM


Posts: 1585
Joined: June 27, 2016



sad eyes,
regarding jail visits: I have no desire at all to go to the jail. and no reason to see him. he does call and I talk to him 15 mins about once every week or two. usually ends in me sending $ to his commissary account. I am starting to feel uneasy about that. seems like the same old pattern.

the first weeks he was in jail my husband tried to visit 3 times. Each time the employees in the waiting area made 'mistakes' and husband did not get a visit. after waiting an hour and others going in to have their visit, guard said "you were crossed off the list". next time he arrived so early guard told him to come back in a hour. husband said, do I have to sign in? guard said - no, I will tell the next guard on duty. went back at the right time, and was told - list is full, your not on it... and a third time - something similar …

Last week My daughter was visiting from the west coast. She decided to visit him. first she was told her summer style cardigan sweater was not OK to wear bc it did not have buttons and was considered too baggy. If she took off the sweater she was wearing a sleeveless top - not allowed. she left and bought a t-shirt. went back. she got in and waited, and then was told he refused to see her. she heard the guards saying something about medical. she asked the guard who was escorting her out if he had a medical problem of if he really refused to see her. guard said he refused. very soon after that our son tried calling us (I was at work, didn't pick up) and finally got thru to his sister to say he had broken a tooth and was in the medical office when he tried to visit.

The last phone call from my son: he is sounding better, more character in his voice.

This is a county jail for short term stays. He is in a group of people who have a little freedom. he is doing OK. I guess its like rehab in the sense they cant leave. food is poor and limited. uses commissary $ for extra snacks and personal items.

I still know that he can not live with us. Too much has happened. Too much PTSD - bad reminders around the house for us and him. wrecked truck in garage, and so on.
I hope he easily decides to find a sober living arrangement. I have not brought it up lately. I am going to start printing information and mailing it to him.



This post has been edited by NyToFlorida on July 15, 2019, 9:35 PM
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Posted: July 16, 2019, 5:00 PM


Posts: 122
Joined: December 30, 2018



NYT gosh what a process, must of been frustrating, obviously strict rules and requlations, I suppose in one sense you feel at ease as when he's out your constantly worrying where what he is doing, where he is etc, I feel my sons addiction has become mine, in the sense that I consume myself with reading about drugs, people's stories( no ones is the same) it's like your always looking for an answer, and sadly there never will be, I was reading yesterday about the guy think he's called John Lewis'( guy from sons of anarchy, before my son started with drugs I would of just thought what a idiot getting so bad with drugs, so really all my reading and everything I can understand it more, not that that's an excuse, just a better understanding of it all, I wish we did't have to do this, maybe the time in jail for your son, hopefully he is slowly getting a clearer head, maybe help with counciling and sober groups meeting whatever it might be a step in the right direction for him, does he see one in jail?, hope you don't mind me asking theses questions, I hope he gets the help he needs, take care
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Posted: July 16, 2019, 7:55 PM


Posts: 209
Joined: December 23, 2018



oh man NY2FL - my son is out of jail again - 4th time, never for drugs always for violating court orders & terms of probation for contacting ex-gf who now has restraining order again (he's violated orders DOZENS & DOZENS of times in since 4/10/19) Fortunately for us, we were in Denali Nat. Park without cell or internet so I didn't get his message needing money to get his truck out until a few days later. Started with "had most of the money, needed just a few hundred.... (yes, we caved - gave him the money...), then needed a little more.... then nothing for a week. As we left Denali, messages popped up "hello?".... Dammit - I answered (very sarcastically) that I thought I hadn't heard from him because we was in rehab. Oh no, "OMG Mom, guess what - I've got a job, they want me NOW, $52 an hour......blah blah blah.... I just replied "how much?" I'm tired, I know it's my fault I continue to enable. I know there is no job, it's most likely an interview at best & as soon as they start checking they'll realize he was fired from the railroad for drugs & has been an active user for the past couple of years & he's on probation for 3 years on 3 different cases and he has a restraining order..... I've never visited him in jail.... I hate even accepting the phone calls. He's still my son & what he is doing to himself & us is killing me slowly
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Posted: July 16, 2019, 8:26 PM


Posts: 15
Joined: July 11, 2019



Mntmom
I feel you frustration. I give into my son, sometimes and I get so angry with myself. I have got better about saying no to him. I feel like I give in thinking it will keep him away from me. He got out of jail a few weeks ago. We have a restraining order against him. He still comes here. As long as he is not caught here, he will not be arrested. So he is in and out. Do not let him in the house. He has never stole from us, I do not want to be sitting in a jail cell because I did not follow the order. Works both ways. He uses our pool to cool down and get clean in the middle of the night. But when he shows up in the middle of the day, it is usually some kind of drama that is caused by him.
Have you ever gone to support meetings? My daughter and I are going to our first one tomorrow night. I need to be stronger and not give in to even listening to the bulls%it. Like you, this is going to kill me if I do not set boundaries and stick with them. Not fall victim to the stories and worry about myself. Hoping the meetings will help me. It’s hard, they are still our children. I need to remind myself, this is his choice.
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Posted: July 16, 2019, 9:07 PM


Posts: 1585
Joined: June 27, 2016



Going to meeting is a great idea. I was seeing a therapist at the recovery center a year ago. It helps to vent. Parenting saw therapist and also councilor for abused women. That’s a great idea too - we are being abused when we are coerced into doing what we don’t want to do. A few years ago I went to nar a non meetings w my husband. It was a good group and helped us get on the same page.. at least it is a good step in helping yourself.

I have a hard time facing my son and saying no. Which is why I left town a few months ago. If we don’t have contact I can’t give in... but he is calling me for commissary money and I give it... so same old same old... It’s so tough. I don’t want to leave again when he gets out of jail.

I feel the same way, don’t want to give, but do, then I make myself forget about it. Hope it is temporary.

PS - last year I went to a alanon group meeting a few times. It wasn’t that good. So if one group does not feel right, try another

I want to get our house ready to sell, but it is such a chore. I’m not too productive at it. Husband is not ready to move and sees no reason to. So he isn’t helping. :(

This post has been edited by NyToFlorida on July 16, 2019, 9:17 PM
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Posted: July 16, 2019, 9:24 PM


Posts: 15
Joined: July 11, 2019



We are retiring in another year, will be moving to another state. Would love to leave knowing he is getting help. Jail seemed to clear his head, but he was not in there long enough. If he acts up and we call the police, he will get a year in jail. I have no problem with that. No drugs there.
I know I have to get myself healthy again if I want any kind of happiness. Considering a group for dealing with mental illness also. I need as much help as I can get. I went with my daughter to one of her therapist appointments. Did not go well, she blamed me for everything. Not sure I will do that again.
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Posted: July 17, 2019, 11:28 AM


Posts: 20
Joined: March 13, 2019



Hello NyToFlorida. My daughter has been in jail 2 times for violating her probation. This last time was 90 days. She didn’t want us to see her there. She said it would make the time there so much harder. Maybe that is what is happening
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Posted: July 17, 2019, 6:10 PM


Posts: 1585
Joined: June 27, 2016



Maybe. I don’t feel like there’s anything to say to him. It would be awkward.
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Posted: July 17, 2019, 9:08 PM


Posts: 478
Joined: November 9, 2018



I have heard (not sure if true or not) there are drugs in jail and people will trade cigs, food, other things for them. Had anyone else heard this?
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Posted: July 17, 2019, 9:26 PM


Posts: 32
Joined: July 16, 2019



NyToFlorida:

I have lived in both states and in NJ.

The giving in you described is called codependence. Loving, compassionate, and empathetic people, especially those emotionally harmed by the addictions of loved ones and close friends, have trouble with tough love.

After 30 years of sobriety, I just got out of a codependant relationship with my now ex-girl friend. She is slowly dying of breast cancer and hooked on pain killers and other illicit substances making it that much tougher to not give into her demands. But I am going through some tough financial times so I couldn't keep giving her money and buying things for her, my kids had to come first and I was at risk for becoming homeless. I was also becoming resentful because my passive-aggressiveness wouldn't let me say no, but it upset me that I did give into her demands. She didn't care as long as I met her demands.

I am seeking help for the underlying causes and I suggest you do too. Counseling or therapy is one avenue, Al-Anon or Nar-Anon or whatever the 12-step group is for people affected by your child's illness, Neurotics Anonymous or its offshoot Emotions Anonymous, possibly religous counseling.

This post has been edited by SoberInMI on July 17, 2019, 9:28 PM
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Posted: July 19, 2019, 11:11 AM


Posts: 375
Joined: October 25, 2016



I quit visiting my son in jails or mental hospitals. He always has a list of things he needs me to do for him. He is persistent and abusive when I say no. I quit answering phone calls because they are expensive from jail and constant. I changed my phone number to get some peace from his demands/begging and from the continual crisis his life had become. Always needing things or replacing things he lost or broke. Cars towed, impound fees, wrecks, repairs, bills ... same as others. And yes there was always something he needs for a new job ... but no job happens or it doesn’t last long. He is a good manipulator! I learned never to give cash but his needs were overwhelming.

I have heard they can get drugs in prison but not sure about county jail. I don’t deposit anything in commissary accounts. I think they can gamble or trade items which seems like too much interaction with other people that could lead to trouble. I will order a care package sometimes.

I went to a meeting once but wasn’t that great. Counseling was the best for me but I lost my counselor. I found that this group has been the biggest help. Hearing others tell their stories and finding out I am not alone in the way I feel and things I do. It would be nice to talk to a counselor again. My family doesn’t want to hear about son’s problems or my problems. They are ready to move on and I am still trying to separate myself. I’m not sure I will ever completely succeed but am doing better since stepping away and limiting contact with my son. I know I have some issues myself that should be addressed such as PTSD and grief.

Meth Mom/Newby- My sons drug of choice is Meth so I understand. Of course, he has used other drugs too. I haven’t been talking about it here lately because maybe I am stabilizing and moving on a bit. I thought reliving it all the time might not be very good for me but I still read the posts regularly. I worry very often about him showing up at our door and disturbing our peace. I don’t want a confrontation that we have to deal with. It breaks my heart to not let him in our house and have to call the police. He has used various drugs for about 25 years now. He has mental issues as a result. He needs more help than we can give him because we are getting older. We had to let him go his own way. It has been very hard. One of the most difficult things I have ever had to do.

This post has been edited by BugginMe on July 19, 2019, 11:29 AM

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BUGS
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Posted: July 19, 2019, 5:48 PM


Posts: 15
Joined: July 11, 2019



Bug,
You have been dealing with this for a very long time, I’m sorry. Yep, when my son was in jail I blocked collect calls, did not put money on books for him. My daughter paid for a calling card, but he did not call me. She also went to visit him. I couldn’t and probably wouldn’t because of restraining order.
My family has been through hell for 5 years now. It got worse last year. On top of the meth, he is now hearing voices and desperately Needs mental help. When he was arrested for restraining order, not drugs we asked to have a hold put in him. The police are so overwhelmed with homeless and drug abuse, they really do not go out of there way to help.
My middle daughter and I went to a nar-anon meeting for the first time the other night. Not too sure it is what I need, very structured. Did not find anything personal about the meeting itself. After, we did have people ask us questions. The majority had addicts in recovery. I feel comfortable here, just reading the posts helps me.
My son knows we are moving out of state next year. Have told him I will help him get out of here, (not with us), but only if he is clean. He needs to want help, and so far has not. He blames all his problems on the voices. Can relate to lost and broken. Gave him new phone and told him it was the last one he will get from me. Have moved most of his stuff into storage, where he can not get to it. Figure the less he has to worry about the better. He can not pawn any of it either. Will not give him our location when we move, even if he is clean. He will never stop being needy, and there will always be drama. We are retiring and want to enjoy whatever time we have left. Sounds cold, but that’s how I feel right now.
Good luck with your son. They are was relentless and do not follow boundaries. They know moms have a weak spot, and they take advantage of it.

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Posted: July 19, 2019, 5:52 PM


Posts: 1585
Joined: June 27, 2016



Buggs thanks for posting. 25 is a lot of years. Sorry your son and you and family have struggled so long. I am seeing that cost... for the time he is in jail we don’t have to worry about the unknown but I am still giving an average of $40 each week... it adds up... then when he gets out we won’t take him in... more costs if he goes to sober living or wherever for rent.. new clothes, job, etc... all costs that he should have been doing for himself... yuck... again... we will do the minimum, but it will be more than we want to.

Sober - sorry about your situation. It is a sad, difficult decision. That is the point I got to near the beginning of the year. Too much was on his terms, not mine. With no reciprocating

Momtometh - you are right in all you say. We get pushed to make those hard decisions in order to save ourselves.


This post has been edited by NyToFlorida on July 19, 2019, 5:58 PM
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Posted: July 20, 2019, 11:06 AM


Posts: 32
Joined: July 16, 2019



NY to Florida:

The fact that it was a codependent relationship made it difficult. But my ex-girlfriend wasn't a loved one and each bad act pushed me further away. Had it been a loved one, it would have been infinitely harder and longer to break free, if at all. While I can identify or recognize myself and empathize with the parents and spouses of addicts, my suffering doesn't compare.

This post has been edited by SoberInMI on July 20, 2019, 11:12 AM
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Posted: August 27, 2019, 1:21 AM


Posts: 122
Joined: December 30, 2018



NYT how are things going with your son? hope he is getting his head round things a bit better, maybe been in there is clearing his head a bit, I hope you are doing ok, hope you don't mind me asking
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Posted: August 27, 2019, 6:11 PM


Posts: 1585
Joined: June 27, 2016



Hello sad eyes - I don’t mind you asking. Son is ok in jail. He will be out in a few weeks. I am just about feeling ‘normal ‘ but still feeling like crying once a day and very tired after work, my ‘get up and go’ has left me. He says he will go to a program- rehab - sober living. It is a local place. My husband says he doesn’t want to , but since we won’t take him in, he will have to. He is in jail for a DWI on drugs - which happened a year ago. But came time to deal with it with the recent arrest at the deli. He decided to stay in jail instead of probation. Husband did get some recent visits in. Said he looks good. But still talks like the stuff never happened or isn’t his fault.. no real sincere talk about changing. Maybe we shouldn’t judge him by what he doesn’t say. I just have to be firm in not letting him take advantage of us. I am nervous about seeing him. Everything feels awkward. He still says he just needs a car and a phone. But.. his lic has been suspended and we are firm that we will not buy a car or put him on our insurance.
I’m hoping he does the right things and makes life easy for all of us instead of harder.

I understand, even though your son is not a disruption, you still worry and wish a better life for him.

This post has been edited by NyToFlorida on August 27, 2019, 6:12 PM
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Posted: August 28, 2019, 6:00 AM


Posts: 122
Joined: December 30, 2018



NYT thanks for the update, I know what you mean by your get up and go, I am the same, just had two days off, In my head I am going to do all sorts, I have in the last couple of hours been trying to catch up on things, as I am back at work tomorrow, and feel again I have wasted my days off, I never use to be like this, anyway good to hear your son looks well, I do think it is long term rehab they need, this is something that they cannot conquer themselves, I to feel awkward at asking the things I should be asking, I feel I never want to rock the boat! My son has been on probation, it has all come to an end this week, he did do everything they wanted never missed any appointments etc, did counciling, I would love to buy him a one way ticket somewhere, and see if he can sort his s*** out somewhere else, so I can feel at peace, mind you I would still worry, I do hope your son chooses rehab sober living it is a start in the right direction, in the meantime we just have to try and stay strong
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Posted: September 15, 2019, 1:11 PM


Posts: 1585
Joined: June 27, 2016



My husband and I are now talking about how much to give our son while he is at the rehab center. Is one pack of cigarettes and $20 a week too much? We know we will not let him live at home. We will never buy him a car, pay insurance, etc. co sign any loan. I would rather see him take public transportation for the rest of his life.

$30 a week seems like such a small amount to deny him, but we want to cut off our enabling completely. Do we wait until he has a job?

Even though the amount is small it still feels the same. Phone call to mom. I only need cigs.. and a sweatshirt... and I washed his awful duffle bag of stinky clothes and dropped it off. This is the last time! How many times we say that... and it’s only $30 a week... I am talking myself thru this... in doing these small tasks I am reinforcing the behavior.. whether it’s $$10 or $100 it’s the same behavior... I need to get out of it, let myself off the hook and let him off the hook... just had this realization - like he is fishing - cast the hook - see if mom bites ... this is the behavior that he has to reprogram ... there was a rehab program in the past that talked about the hustle.. living in active addiction- every day is a hustle. One of the goals of the program was to not allow them to participate in any hustling type of activity.. may son is still at that point - hustling. Example - trading snacks at the jail. Playing ping pong for soup packets.. it’s childs play, but the same game.

We were not allowed to see him when we dropped off the clothes. That’s ok, it was easier that way. The center he is at is Christian based. There is a shelter men can live and even if not in rehab program. So when our son says he had no place to live. We can say - live there. The program should bridge the gap from addiction to independence. From homeless to job and apartment. I think us parents need to be ‘hands off’. Let the program do what it is designed to do. Therefore, I need to be very slow at giving cigs and cash now.

One last thought - my son is very capable of working. We know he can succeed with half the effort that was spent while living in active addiction. That’s something to remember. HE CAN DO IT!


Thanks for listening. I hope my ramble helps others.



This post has been edited by NyToFlorida on September 15, 2019, 1:25 PM
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Posted: September 15, 2019, 1:50 PM


Posts: 478
Joined: November 9, 2018



You are so spot on with everything you said NTF....I really hope he takes good advantage of this opportunity to turn his life around. Me personally, I would just give him the cigs and no $.
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Posted: September 15, 2019, 2:27 PM


Posts: 1585
Joined: June 27, 2016



Lol - I was too generous for the past 4 months. I was / am afraid to say no. Not for any reason, just want to do good things. I have to make myself understand that even a little bit in my sons situation is not a good thing...

My husband and I were talking about it this morning, then we went about separate chores, then a few hours later, he told me he thinks son is in a program and maybe ok to help, at the same time I convinced myself of the opposite! He camecto my side, I went to his side of the fence... lol... there’s no right answer and we are Not equipped to deal w this, or make these decisions!!!
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