|Printable Version of Topic
Click here to view this topic in its original format
|Message Board > Families / Partners of Addicts > Why Don't They Want It?|
|Posted by: Sallyanna March 18, 2019, 11:33 PM|
|I have a hard time understanding why they don't want sobriety enough to do what it takes. I can only think how awful everything is in their life. Why don't they want to make positive choices toward a better life? I understand the addiction, I guess I don't understand why they just get more and more miserable. Any thoughts you may have are appreciated.|
|Posted by: AddictMomMerryGoRound March 18, 2019, 11:58 PM|
|Oh, do I understand the anguish and the heartache! We as parents want more than they can desire from life. It is so hard to let this go. Tonight, I watched my son come in and I know that he is using again. The classic signs remain...no self care with showering or eating regular meals and the occasional guilt help with the dishes to distract us from the truth. He has 5 legal cases pending and doesn’t seem to care about the outcome. My heart breaks everytime I see him and I hate that I wish that I didn’t see him. Being exposed to their reality on a daily basis is so hard. No words of wisdom just another mother in the trenches of the heartbreak of life with an addict.|
|Posted by: Walkedon March 19, 2019, 2:29 PM|
|I received a text from my daughter ,saying she wants to get sober. She is currently going to IOP and therapy. The therapist suggested she go back to rehab,her PA that prescribes her meds asked her to go back to rehab.
But still she refuses. She hates her life, she hates how she looks,hates that she is estranged from her family,wants to get sober......but refuses to do what needs to be done. Makes me crazy.
|Posted by: Parenting2 March 19, 2019, 6:26 PM|
|I don't know, of course.
I believe some of it is that once they get so bad, with the issues they have with their mental health, it makes it tremendously hard to change. What I mean is that they hurt their health, their relationships, their looks, their jobs...and then most have mental health issues (depression, anxiety, bipolar) on top of. So, it would be hard enough to overcome if you were a mentally strong person. Then, toss in withdrawals, how addiction changes the pleasure centers of the brain...Addiction to the process and the lifestyle. For an active addict, sobriety seems "boring" and they can get addicted to the lifestyle, as well. My son told me he loved the paraphenalia and the process as much as the drugs. I could relate a little because I smoked cigarettes as a teenager. I felt that way, for sure. What a mix.
It is possible and none of this is an excuse. In my opinion, we need what we don't have. Affordable, expert, long-term rehabilation. This revolving door of a few days here and then out the door and then onto something else....not effective.
I still firmly believe they can do on it on their own if they have the desire. I have seen it with some friends. In the end, they have to want it. And, it is easier to stay in the crap.
|Posted by: Sallyanna March 20, 2019, 10:07 PM|
|Thanks all for sharing your thoughts. My daughter who has always adored me has become angry and bitter towards me which is totally new behavior for her. She is blaming me for the sh*t show her life has become. I've always been available to her and support her emotionally and tried to be understanding. I'm so done with all this crap (sorry) it's soooo fu*ked up I can't deal with it anymore. This has been going on for 10 years now...ugh.!|
|Posted by: Sallyanna March 20, 2019, 10:09 PM|
|I'm really sick and tired of it.|
|Posted by: NyToFlorida March 21, 2019, 9:43 AM|
|The ups and downs of the roller coaster. It is so stressful. Watch YouTube videos . See if you can find ‘stages of addiction’. Keep telling her to talk to someone in her support group. Such as therapist, social worker, etc. keep it simple. And be less available.|
|Posted by: YellowBirds March 22, 2019, 6:11 PM|
|SALLYANNA - Sorry your daughter's behaviour has changed. I think it's a consequence of the drugs. My son was angry in the summer, but now he is the complete opposite. It's strange and unpredictable.|
|Posted by: Sallyanna March 22, 2019, 7:25 PM|
|Thank you for the info NTF and Yellowbirds I sure hope she switches back. Yes a rollercoaster and unpredictable for sure.|
|Posted by: samegame March 23, 2019, 1:29 PM|
|I don't think it's so much not wanting sobriety in that they fear change. Most addicts and alkie their chemical and associated lifestyle become THE priority in their life. That's all they know. They are afraid of change. Many have been doing so long they can't even a picture a sober life.
I think some of these programs realize that. If you take away the chemical you have to put something back in it's place. It could a new way of life/program, a religion, a job, family etc but when that chemical goes something must take it's place. If not they'll put the chemical right back in their life.
There are so many variables though. The addict and supporters must learned to read and act on those variables. Remember it's not just about removing the chemical from their life it's putting something back in it's place, hopefully a better quality and more acceptable way of life.
|Posted by: Sallyanna March 23, 2019, 1:46 PM|
|I agree with you samegame. They have to replace their addictive activities with healthy activities. If they have been addicted for a long time they have to practice and relearn. It may seem 'boring' to them because they live in chaos most the time.|
|Posted by: Sallyanna March 25, 2019, 10:20 PM|
|My daughter has switched back to her sweet self and I'm so relieved. Sometimes I wonder if they 'black out' and don't realize what they say or they just get so frustrated, IDK. I really hope she decides to go back to detox then rehab soon. It's her choice and I hope she'll choose help over chaos. Just wanted to give an update.|
|Posted by: Parenting2 March 26, 2019, 2:48 PM|
|In general, we have to face all the days sober. Because they are high or drunk, they don't fully experience it. My son does not remember the very terrifying times we had when he was on spice. He is doing better than those days. I don't bring it up often, but I will clarify if he says something stupid about how things were that bad. I shared here that I was sleeping with mace. He needs to know this. Although, I don't think they ever really comprehend how bad it is/was because they weren't really "present". They are still responsible for it, though. Responsible for the effects on those around them.|
|Posted by: Sallyanna March 26, 2019, 6:56 PM|
|I totally agree with you Parenting2. They are responsible for their behavior 24/7 no matter what.|
|Posted by: sad eyes March 26, 2019, 7:50 PM|
|Addict mom merry go round I agree with you I feel the same the addict could have so much but they have nothing, I have a feeling my son pawned his phone, fishy there, we just know when things aren't right, also my son is the same, sometimes I think aren't you getting showered, never comes home starving like boys do, ( always opening fridge and pantry) some one once told me its depression that, no self care, which I can relate to, when I was having a hard time, my self care was none exsistent, couldent be bothered showering etc, this is a guy he would shower twice a day, then he will do a job, or say I'll do that for you ( sometimes it gets done) like you a guilt trip for them, at the end of the day with or without us they are going to live there life's , really stories I read the successful ones do a long time rehab and work a program, rehab is to expensive here,take care|
|Posted by: mtnmom March 26, 2019, 9:45 PM|
|SallyAnna - I feel the same way!! I do NOT understand it. My son has never been as angry at his family as he is this time. Maybe his ex-wife took all his anger & he could hide it from us. But now she has divorced him so I guess we get all of his anger...|
|Posted by: idgie March 27, 2019, 7:16 AM|
|oh my beautiful people, you are trying to understand addiction with logic and reason. This doesn't work because addiction is not logical or reasonable. it doesn't conform to any of the norms you understand and live by.
It is a form of insanity.
I truly don't believe it is possible to understand the nature of addiction/alcoholism unless you have personally experienced it. The alcoholic mind or the addict mind and thinking must seem truly incomprehensible from the outside.
|Posted by: sad eyes March 27, 2019, 7:24 AM|
|Idgie my sons actually said that to me before, " you don't understand until you've been through it" sometimes I've said I understand, and he has said no you don't mum, you don't know what ime thinking, they don't think logical like us,|
|Posted by: constantine March 27, 2019, 4:16 PM|
|Well said Idge...
|Posted by: Walkedon March 27, 2019, 4:37 PM|
|Today my daughter was texting a fellow addict. Telling this friend that he should go to rehab. Both of them say they don't want this life any more.
When I pointed out to my daughter that she too should go to rehab she looked confused. " I'm getting better ,mom "
It drives me crazy. We say we can't help them til the they want it. The problem is they cant even see it.
I want to lock her away for about a year till her brain clears.
|Posted by: Sallyanna March 27, 2019, 10:31 PM|
|Yes it's scary how irrational they are. I just think at some level, they can put 2 and 2 together to see their life is going in the tank because of drugs/alcohol. I'm sure it's overwhelming, hard, and they like their addiction but the price of poker is HIGH. Its a subculture existence yet they choose to live it. I know some say they have to hit rock bottom. My daughter has hit so many rock bottoms I would think even just one would be enough to scare her into sobriety. Sadly, the bottoms get lower and lower.
|Posted by: Sallyanna March 30, 2019, 1:44 PM|
|Just read a good quote.... "Sobriety isn't something you want, or even something you need, it's something you do."|
|Posted by: NyToFlorida March 30, 2019, 7:13 PM|
|you are so right. I read something recently: People don't choose to be addicts (to have the predisposition or illness or whatever we want to call it) They do choose to relapse.
I thought that was a powerful statement.
On the home front: I see my son's pattern. He needs us for car, gas, float him from week to week. The job is just money to serve his habit. the car is just a vehicle to get what he needs. He does not take care of the car. on his own he quickly looses the car, the job, the pay check, the housing.
his phone is off our account. wont pay it, that will be done. we just found out he wrecked the car. cant get to work.(he did not tell us - tow shop called us) no pay after this week. we are waiting for the flag of surrender. Our only answer - go to hospital rehab - go to sober living - we are out of the 'car' business.
conclusion: he needs to live where he can go to work without a car. if someone can not maintain a car, they cant have one.
On your point: so hard for us to understand. example: I need a car to go to work. I will do everything to keep the car running..... that is not my son's priority....
it is a pitty, what these drugs do to our loved ones.
|Posted by: Sallyanna March 31, 2019, 12:31 PM|
|NTF you are wise to give up on giving him a car. I hope he will choose to go to the hospital or sober living. I think he knows now he can't manipulate you anymore which is a good thing. Stay focused on your well being and your new job.|
|Posted by: NyToFlorida March 31, 2019, 1:32 PM|
|thanks for your support. all of the steps we are going thru are things I know, things I have read. we were not able to enforce before this. I know when son is not sober he can not maintain a car and has accidents. before this we were not able to pull the car out from under him. we gave him the chance to succeed. which he has not. the car is going to junk yard. he will be off our insurance forever. he made it easy for us. he wrecked the car. at least we wont feel guilt for 'making him loose his job bc he has no car'. we wont be pysc'd into thinking that 'if he had a car, all would be well'. we have succeeded in getting him out of the house, off the phone plan, off our insurance. we will not go back. we now know it wont work. I guess we had to go thru it all to detach on our own terms. I can think back and say I wish we did this years ago, but we all had to go thru the learning process. we can now be determined not to get sucked in again in the future. husband and I need to lick our wounds and recoop our losses, and will call police if he shows up. hopefully he does not. .
I think active addiction makes him too dumb to see actions = consequences, or not care about possible consequences. the drugs put the brain to sleep like anesthia. he's awake, but half asleep for the past 6 months.
I can live with my (our) decisions bc I know my son knows what to do.
It is sad that we allow them to inflict pain on us, but we are hesitant to inflict pain on them.
shortly before my son left home there was a conversation where my husband told him - I will give you this and this and if you (*fail me*) - there will be war. Son agreed and understood what he meant. (*I don't remember the exact words)
** definitely a subculture existence
|Posted by: samegame March 31, 2019, 3:48 PM|
|Sallyanna -sobriety is something you do
Exactly. Talk is cheap. Physically sober is an accomplishment.
|Posted by: Jointheclub April 6, 2019, 8:55 AM|
|Why don't they want it? A profound question posed by Sallyanna. Amazingly, the addiction seems to feed itself, little by little starving out the addict. To me it seems to be rooted in obsessive-compulsive behavior/disorder. My daughter's addiction would seemingly haunt her, at times awaken her from a dead sleep with cravings. None of us non-addicts can understand this. Can you imagine having a true "one track mind" that you can't shut off? I think the addict would love to shut off their minds, and I think they accomplish just that when they use. So their addiction is much more about relief of the haunting thoughts, sating the crying baby so to speak, than it is about the excitement of the lifestyle and the feeling of the high. But every time they relent to the crying baby, the emboldened screams of the addiction grow louder. It's a never ending cycle, and they are trapped. It's very sad, and I always felt compassion for my daughter for the torment she was experiencing. What a dreadful disease. It's why such a small percentage of addicts ever free themselves. We, as loved ones, can never give up on the addict. While they're still breathing, we have to believe they can be one of the few to escape.|
|Posted by: Sallyanna April 6, 2019, 1:18 PM|
|Jointheclub your post makes so much sense to me. It describes my daughter's addiction so well. Right now she's in full blown active addiction and her communication with me has been erratic which scares me. Today we had a planned phone call to talk at a specific time. No answer. Last she said was she was wanting to go back for help so we were going to go over the details together. This is so tough. I'll never give up on her and always be available. Its just hard to know what to do in the meantime and when she's really out of it. I know she's suffering and using to cope. I hope she will get the help she needs soon. Thank you very much for your post.|
|Posted by: mtnmom April 6, 2019, 5:38 PM|
|my son can't keep his stories, I mean lies straight. He lies about EVERYTHING!! EVERYTHING!!! His ex reached out & I am absolutely amazed at what he has told her about us, his brothers, his own life. He is so narcissistic - he believes he is a super hero, he's seen & done everything & has done it better than anyone, ever. Told her he has owned several of his own businesses (no), was a contractor & home inspector (again, no). Of course he left out that he started doing meth in high school, hide it from family & friends for years. Bought & lost 2 different homes, has been arrested numerous times for stupid drug/alcohol assaults/fights/childish stuff & a couple of times for dangerous, Dom Violence stuff. Has ruined 3 serious relationships, had had restraining orders against him, divorced once. Wrecked IDK how many vehicles - owes fines, has outstanding tickets, owes taxes, back taxes.... The ONLY good thing that has come from his crazy life is he never had a child.|
|Posted by: NyToFlorida April 6, 2019, 8:44 PM|
|join the club: the same here for my son. he says he cant sleep bc of racing thoughts, persistant thoughts, going over all the bad things that have happened in the past 10 years. when he was sober in summer 2018, he did get medication - quitepine (Seroquel). It helped greatly in being able for the thoughts to calm down so he could sleep. when he was in rehab for a week (they say) he did not sleep for 6 days, then they gave him a medication (odd that they let it go so long) he has always had trouble with insomnia and that is the worst part of his withdrawals. along with the thoughts.
sad thing is that if he stayed sober long enough, bad things would not happen and if he actually sincerely apologized to people and kept his promises, he would not have so much bad things to think about. when he was in treatment once he wrote letters to his family, but did not give them to us!
my son had the best 3 months of sobriety. I have hope he can do it again and if he adds some good behavioral therapy, he may be successful. he has to want to change his life.
yes to your description of feeding the addiction.
|Posted by: NyToFlorida April 6, 2019, 8:59 PM|
|mtnmom - it is so relentless. I told my husband your recent experience paying your son's truck payment. he says Thank You for sharing so he remembers NOT to go that route. my son wrecked his/our car - says a truck ran him off road - hit pole - at lunch break. at noon he cant even stay on the road. the road he was on is windy and narrow, but people don't hit poles every day. he was probably driving too fast and looking at phone. the pole does not snap if you are driving slow. he does not understand that he needed to keep the car drivable to get to work. I don't understand how that is not a priority. drive slow, stay off phone ( sorry for my rant)
I guess I do understand that he only has one priority and his brain is thinking at a very low level of comprehension.
husband will give him a ride to work next week (he offered, don't know if son will do it) I don't expect it to last long. son now lives 30 mins in opposite direction of job. I am staying out of it. son is talking like he wants to fix the truck he wrecked in September. big ideas, no resources. husband needed reminder to not get sucked in.
son had several fender benders w the car only in march and something hit our ins company - he rear ended someone. in February, grill was banged up.
*** Its never his fault ***
weird - husband and I have not hit a pole ever, or rear ended anyone in 40 years of driving. my last accident was more than 30 years ago when someone rear ended me!
I think the difficult part for us is that we think they learn a lesson (like we would) and we know transportation is key to keeping a job, and we want him to keep a job....
we are wrong - we cant want these things more than he does. at some level we think getting him to work will help him succeed. we don't want to be the reason for his failure (to work)…
collectively, it is hard to say no even when we know we are wrong to help them.
we are trying to get our son to move to a sober living where he can work and live in a community where he does not have to drive.
it is dangerous to the sober people on the road to let our son drive again.
|Posted by: Sallyanna April 6, 2019, 9:06 PM|
|I texted my daughter later this afternoon to ask if she was ok? (she did not answer her phone earlier for our planned phone time). Her response was 'yea'. This is so hard to know what to do. I really hate this feeling. Its become a tangled ball of yarn and I just want to unravel it. Does anyone else feel this way?|
|Posted by: NyToFlorida April 6, 2019, 9:09 PM|
|sallyanna - so sorry you are going thru it again. be at peace knowing you have done as much as you can. this is the first time in 6 years that I have taken a break from my son. so far my husband is OK with it. he told son I moved out of the area bc I could not deal with either one of them anymore. son just shook his head. he has not contacted me. I have had a peaceful and exhausting week one of my new job.
PS - I try not to think that my son could stay in the subculture for many years, avoiding sobriety.
|Posted by: mtnmom April 6, 2019, 9:11 PM|
|I'm SO SAD, so anxious, nervous, etc.|
|Posted by: NyToFlorida April 6, 2019, 9:12 PM|
|sallyanna - I do remember those times a year ago. when my son was in heavy addiction and we kicked him out. I would worry if I did not hear from him. If I got a response like 'yea', then I was able to sleep that night. wait for the next day.
mtnmom - I would be upset too, after the phone calls you and your husband received. at this time I am relieved my son does not have a car. what ever he does is not our fault.
we were hoping he would have taken our offer to give him a plane ticket to the sober living he had been at a few yrs ago. he would only have to work and pay rent and follow the rules. public transportation was available.
|Posted by: Sallyanna April 6, 2019, 9:14 PM|
|I'm so happy you are feeling better. Do you like your new job? I'm going to put my mind on me for the rest of the weekend and do somethings I enjoy. Today I really worried all day...|
|Posted by: Sallyanna April 6, 2019, 9:19 PM|
|So sorry mtnmom I understand your sadness and anxiety. I think like NTF said we have done the best we can and at some point they have to pick up the rope. Its there they have to pick it up. Sadly, they trip on it and it gets tied in knots then whatever else can happen to a rope!?!|
|Posted by: NyToFlorida April 6, 2019, 9:20 PM|
|thank you. I like the new job. computer IT stuff. there is so much new applications and information to learn. I am happy to be learning. and grateful the manager saw that I am capable of learning. I am getting a bit older and never reached a high point in my career bc I worked part time when the kids were young, so I got a late start. I have been 'terminated' a few times in recent years - I am getting used to it and feel confident I will find a new job. the last one and this one were found using an employment agency. I don't need benefits, so I don't care if I stop and start jobs, just as long as the paychecks are coming in.!
the weekend is toooo short!
|Posted by: NyToFlorida April 6, 2019, 9:35 PM|
|I'm not sure what clicked for me. to make me leave my home and family and feel at peace with it. 2018 was a year of large car expenses - son wrecked husband's truck. Husband loved the truck so we had it fixed. very expensive. I needed a newer car - mine went to junk yard. my husband pick up a truck for son for a grand and put some work into it. paying registrations, insurances... repairs … Oh - just remembered - we got ripped off buying a car for 2300, put a radiator in it for 500 then realized it was a bad head gasget - I got stuck with it over heating and towed it straight to junk yard after having it only a few weeks - with over heating problems every day. called the seller who ignored me. he sold us a shi**y car and basically took our $$ and we got nothing.
we bought a temp car for me for 1000, which my son was now driving and just wrecked after wrecking his truck in September. we did find a good car for me that I am happily driving.
I let son drive it in January for a few days - he broke the change compartment. (When they are impaired everything gets broken and lost.) I was firm on not letting him drive it after that.
when son went to rehab and was sober. I saw how well he was doing (unfortunately he said he was still miserable and it was not well or fun or easy)
then in the fall to winter he relapse and I was 'helping' him by stocking fridge with all his favorites - food for lunches - making dinner almost every night - gas - cigs as needed, paying student loan and minimum on a credit card.... all of this and NO THANKS from him.... no effort to start paying something. nearly half my check was going to his stuff - he was making same as me. he got to keep his whole check and take half of mine! I was not able to save anything and my share of paying household bills was getting squeezed....
when I asked him for $$ from paycheck - for myself and for his bills - it quickly became a Hot Mess. WTF !!
with the help of everyone here I finally saw how ridiculous and unfair this was.
Still he has not made amends. not even a sorry.
I am not angry - I let it be done to me - I simply vow to not let it happen again.
*** LOL - I think A LOT Clicked for me ***
|Posted by: mtnmom April 6, 2019, 10:04 PM|
|It clicked for us probably last week & clicked & locked behind me after the calls & attacks. I am so thankful I live 1000 miles away from him, but also my other sons. My sons understand that this is not their brother doing this, this is a meth monster that has possessed his life. He is a bull in a china closet, one horrific decision after another. I do hope that he has no choice but to detox & find a long term sober living house. But I've decided now that even if he gets sober & tries to contact us, I will tell him not without a counselor or therapist.
I do find so much support from you all here. Thank you for being there.
|Posted by: NyToFlorida April 6, 2019, 10:13 PM|
|mtnmom - I have thought I would like to see my son making it on his own for a year in sobriety before I let my guard down. a few months is not enough. a few weeks is just a lie. I want to see him actually paying bills and going into a grocery store.
when I read your posts I think of duchesschama who was posting a lot in the past 2 years. he son is similar to your son's situations - age and raging and relentless.
try putting duchesschama into the search option at bottom of page and reading some of her posts.
she had told him 'don't contact us for 6 months or a year'
|Posted by: Sallyanna April 7, 2019, 6:03 AM|
|Woke up early this morning and my mind started thinking about all of this. I think at some level my daughter feels abandoned and at some level I feel like I have abandoned her. I'm always available to her when she wants to communicate however I won't let her live with me. I won't let her live with me because of the chaos and unpredictability and everything else which comes along with active addiction. I am my sole provider for myself and I know it would affect my well being and my job. Its hard not to feel badly about this and to hear and watch her struggle so. She knows and even called to go back to detox but she hasn't gone yet. It is very unsettling and sad. I always pray for her.|
|Posted by: NyToFlorida April 7, 2019, 3:37 PM|
|sallyanna - a month ago when I left home my son did text a few times. I was not responding. He stated things like: "how do you think it feels to be kicked to the curb and abandoned" and "treated like an animal" "you are the worst parents, I never want to see you again" "I cant believe you would treat me like this"
I am sure they feel alone, but we have not abandon them. it is their interpretation. I did text back that he was treating himself like an animal - he said No. He cant believe I treat HIM this way.... what about the way he has treated us and our generosity for years.
There's no win for anyone. hope we all survive.
It sounds like she does not want to go to detox yet. when my son was in a sober living a few yrs ago, he left and rented a room and worked. 4 months later he was homeless. I told him over and over to go to the sober living - during business hours - and tell them he needs help - he would say OK but didnt.
|Posted by: mtnmom April 7, 2019, 10:41 PM|
|NYtoFL - I have read your posts & comments. I hope she is OK too. I learned today that my son reached out to a cousin he has always been close to - but in talking to her, he was lying through out his cries for help. My little light at the end of the tunnel hasn't flickered completely out yet, but almost. He left her house a few hours after he had her (cousin) text his ex-gf & tell her he was out of her house & staying with cousin. They found a rehab bed for him available tomorrow at 9am. So he left to get his stuff & will meet them tomorrow morning at 7am.... I'm afraid it was all a game to trick his GF into go back to her house.
|Posted by: Sallyanna April 8, 2019, 8:14 PM|
|Thanks for your post NTF. Mntmom did he go to rehab today?|
|Posted by: hurtingmom April 14, 2019, 6:45 PM|
|Hi All!!! I know I'm late to the party. But . . .
I, too, have wondered why my daughter didn't want sobriety . . . being clean & sober . . . . returning to her everything-but-a-polo-pony/car college life. I wonder why some addicts can 'recover' after a 30 day program and never look back . . . while others, like her, went to more programs than a dozen in 8 months. I spent a lot of money in therapy, trying to understand this and trying to forgive myself. I sincerely thought that I did not provide my girl with the necessary skills to cope with life on life's terms. I also thought I failed to teach her self-control or delayed gratification or the 10 Commandments or something.
I've had to remember that my child has a life path of her own. For a while, her life path intermingled with mine. And I had some control and influence. I, like each of you, nurtured my child and loved her unconditionally . . . with all of my being. I tried to prepare her to continue her path independently. To be successful, happy and productive. Here's the news!!! We are not responsible . . . and we should not beat ourselves up . . . addiction is more about how the addict perceives him/herself and how s/he deals with the world. This is between them and God. We can only watch and hope, and pray for their safety.
I agree with everything that Idgee, Con etc said regarding us trying to make rational sense out of, or to put the imprint of logic on, addiction. What I'd like to add is that part of addiction, at least according to my therapist, is genetically determined. She said that there are up to 4 markers for addiction. Everyone has one marker. At one extreme . . . the folks who only have one marker . . . these are the people who did coke recreationally, for example, but never get hooked. At the other extreme are folks who have all 4 markers, such as my daughter. These folks get hooked really quick and have a very very difficult time finding and staying in remission. That is, addiction is not a choice.
Sending hugs to all who are battling & all who love someone who is struggling,
|Posted by: Sallyanna April 14, 2019, 10:16 PM|
|Hurtingmom thank you for your post and sharing about the 4 markers. It's very helpful to know and it explains why sobriety is so hard for some. I think it applies to my daughter. Numerous detoxes, rehabs, sober living...I keep praying for her.|
|Posted by: Noodle April 16, 2019, 2:15 PM|
I love reading your posts and am so happy you still pop in from time to time. I have read your entire story and am so sorry for the loss of your beautiful daughter. I thought you were gone and am happy you are not!
I am thankful for your post explaining how some can become addicted after only one use it IS very helpful. I appreciate your words all the time.
Thank you again for adding such helpful posts.
|Posted by: Parenting2 April 16, 2019, 9:03 PM|
Just seconding that it is great to see you post and I think of you often!
|Posted by: hurtingmom April 16, 2019, 10:16 PM|
|Thanks Noodle & Parenting!! Yes, I pop in and check-in on ya'll. Ya'll couldn't get rid of me if you tried. LOL. I just don't have a lot to add, or I feel my perspective is so dark sometimes. But I'm around!!
Thanks Noodle re my daughter. After 32 months, there are still so many questions . . . and tears. . . and guilty feelings. Addiction is beyond horrible for the addict and hell for those that love them.
Love you guys!
|Posted by: Jointheclub April 17, 2019, 1:59 PM|
|Hurtingmom, I'm so glad you're sticking around too. You and I will always grieve the loss of our daughters, but we also have a unique perspective to share with those on the forum. All the posts inspire me every time I logon. The people here are very special. The tenacity and love you all show your addicted loved-ones is amazing. I think Hurtingmom will agree: no matter how hard it gets, hanging in there and supporting them is better than not having them with you. There is hope that each addict will finally see the light. Many do after years of active addiction. We don't know the date nor the time, but their lightbulbs can and will illuminate. We just have to believe they'll soon get it. Again, you all inspire me. I find hope when I read your postings. I pray for you guys every day. Keep the faith, all.|
|Posted by: Walkedon April 17, 2019, 2:55 PM|
|I am trying to be hopeful. My daughter is so much better than she was a year ago. Still using but less and her mental health is better.
I'm trying to see the positive,trying trying trying. I get so frustrated that she's not moving forward anymore. But she is still here and so there is still hope.
Thinking of you, hurtingmom and join the club.
|Posted by: Parenting2 April 17, 2019, 9:47 PM|
|Jointheclub, I think of you often, also. I was so shocked when you posted that your daughter passed away. You and HurtingMom and all those out there that have lost their children are often on my mind and in my heart.
I am SO glad you check in and still find a home here. We all need each other.
I just spoke with a friend today who just lost her niece to an overdose. We shared how addiction is such a cruel and frustrating disease. And, even crueler because the obsession with the drug hurts all those that love the addict.
I don't write much lately about my situation. I think I am kind of in limbo and sort of in a weird type of PTSD state about all that has happened. Kind of shellshocked from the last 3 years. Sigh...I really don't even know how I feel or what I think some days.
I read all the posts and sympathize with all the posters and their situations. It can be just SO grueling this journey. We have to stick together! Even in grief, we have to stick together.
I read about a support here locally for people who have lost a loved one from addiction. They have stories online. There are truly so many families being torn apart by addiction and especially the opioid epidemic. Did people read about the doctors charges in Appalachia area for basically dealing?? SAD.
|Posted by: hurtingmom April 20, 2019, 7:07 PM|
|Awwwww . . . thank you all. You know how to make a girl blush and feel loved!! Free hugs to all!!!
Jointheclub . . . so very sorry for your loss. We are members of a club that no one wants to join. Sending Hugs of understanding & support.
Walkedon . . . as long as she is on this side of the grass, there is hope. I read somewhere that addicts remain psychologically 'stuck' at the age of first use, unless and until they achieve and maintain long-term remission. So, are you expecting her to (or hoping that) she act her chronological age? Is the 'bar' you are setting too high?
I'm not saying ANY of this to criticize you. I'm hoping to provide some insight . . . make you more calm . . . manage your expectations.
Walkedon, be patient with your daughter. The drugs and/or their addiction do a number on their brains, psyche, self-confidence and self-worth. Even though she may be physically 'clean', this doesn't mean that she can jump into 'normie" life. She may be battling mental or emotional demons . . . or residuals from them.
Love her . . . keep the door of communication open . . . support her without enabling . . . .and let her know as long as she is trying that is good enough for you!!!
|Posted by: Walkedon April 20, 2019, 8:56 PM|
|I am expecting my daughter to act 31 and she acts 15. She talks and acts like she's in high school. Unfortunately I then begin to fall in to that role of a teenagers Mom.
This is the main reason I wish she would go to a half way house. She needs to be treated like an adult and learn to act like one.
|Posted by: hurtingmom April 21, 2019, 11:40 PM|
|Walkedon . . . .That's the hard part. Knowing in your heart-of-hearts and souls-of-souls that they need to be treated like adults. Feeling like if we point out the goal, lead them to it, explain it to them, provide a road map . . . that they WILL act like one. Then we wait. Hoping and praying. Crying, screaming and sometimes begging . . . them . . . our Higher Power . . .appealing to what's just and fair. Things may go 'well' for a while. But something is going to happen . . . or not happen. Or, they will be needy . . . or something. And wham!!! Our motherly instincts kick in. And there we are back at enabling, condoning, encouraging, crying, pulling our hair out and/or just helplessly watching (or any combo of the above).
What's a mom to do? All we want is for our kids to succeed. To lead healthy, happy, productive lives. To get off drugs/alcohol and be 'normal' Right? Is that asking too much?
Those are rhetorical questions.
It took me a long long time to accept this. To really and truly internalize it. To believe it and not feel selfish or as if I had given up on my girl. Here's the news. We only have control over us and our actions. So . . . I'm going to ask you the 'real' questions: what can YOU do . . . what do YOU have control over . . .to change these dynamics for YOU? What can YOU do to change YOUR reaction or to make it so that whatever she does/doesn't do, affects YOU less? How can YOU make you feel better? How can you still love your daughter as unconditionally and totally as you so clearly do and keep YOUR sanity? i so wish that there was a one-size-fits-all answer. There isn't. Each of us has to examine ourselves to figure out what works (and doesn't work) for our hearts, minds and souls to find peace.
|Posted by: MomNMore April 27, 2019, 11:48 PM|
|Some oldtimers here...Idgie, Con, me...lots of experience, not all good...lol.
You may never understand what's going on with your addicted loved ones, but the real work is in understanding yourself. Give yourself the gift of a life of your own...sometimes that's the best thing we can show them...what a good life looks like.
Peace ~ M&M
|Posted by: Sallyanna April 28, 2019, 5:53 AM|
|M&M I agree with your wise words. Its hard to do at times however it's the right thing to do for us and for them|